Forums / Getting Technical / Legal & Accounting / The Trust Structures Guide 2005

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  • Profile photo of TerrywTerryw
    Participant
    @terryw
    Join Date: 2001
    Post Count: 16,110

    A new book on trusts has just come out.

    http://www.cch.com.au/fe_ps_details.asp?product_id=4697&itemcode=3954A&bhcp=1
    The Trust Structures Guide 2005

    The Trust Structures Guide 2005 is the definitive guide on how to structure and use trusts. Authoritative, clear and concise, it is a practical book designed to guide you through the area of trusts regardless of your level of experience.

    Features
    Extensive use of flowcharts, checklists & diagrams
    Helps you quickly locate the information you need
    Helps you make informed decisions on the best structure to use
    Designed to guide you through the area of trusts regardless of your level of experience

    Contents
    For each type of trust, the Guide covers:

    the typical structure
    succession planning
    when it should be used
    income tax
    capital gains tax concessions
    implications on asset protection
    flexibility to admit new investors
    liability of directors of corporate trustees
    identifying beneficiaries
    in-specie distributions
    trust to trust transfers
    Division 7A
    resettlements

    ISBN 0 9752067 1 0

    Cost is $250

    Terryw
    Discover Home Loans
    Parramatta
    [email protected]

    Terryw | Structuring Lawyers / Loan Structuring Pty Ltd
    http://propertytaxbook.com.au/
    Email Me

    Lawyer, Mortgage Broker and Tax Advisor (Aust wide) http://propertytaxbook.com.au/

    Profile photo of kpkp
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    @kp
    Join Date: 2004
    Post Count: 509

    Would have to be an interesting read……
    Thanks Terry

    kp

    Profile photo of redwingredwing
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    @redwing
    Join Date: 2003
    Post Count: 2,733

    I’d like to *flick* through at least before deciding on that one..

    has anyone purchased or read it?

    REDWING

    “Money is a currency, like electricity and it requires momentum to make it Effective”
    Count The Currency With This Online Positive Cashflow Calculator

    Profile photo of coastymikecoastymike
    Participant
    @coastymike
    Join Date: 2005
    Post Count: 125

    Its been around for a while now. Ive been purchasing it through the Taxation Institute of Australia for the past few years.

    In my opinion one of the best value books on trusts available. Easy to read, lots of diagrams and great for the professional.

    I think it would be too heavy for the novice but for those interested in a good in-depth discussions on ALL types of trusts this is the book.

    Profile photo of grossrealisationgrossrealisation
    Member
    @grossrealisation
    Join Date: 2005
    Post Count: 1,031

    hi all
    two things
    maybe the people looking to come to the sydney meeting would like to email me if they are willing to chip in for the book.
    second coastymike have you read the post by camder and any chance of you attending as you know alot about trust your call if the answers yes we will have this book for reference

    here to help

    Profile photo of rebecca2rebecca2
    Member
    @rebecca2
    Join Date: 2003
    Post Count: 54

    I dont get it. If a trust couldnt save you from a possible sueing. Why else would you pay $1000 a year for a trust. I have been trying to get my head around it for a couple of years now. Some people say they wouldnt purchase an IP without a trust and others say its not worth the money to pay for the trust. I have a friend that believes that the only reasons that an accountant recomends a trust is to line his own pockets.

    Can anyone enlighten me.[dead2]

    Beck.
    “You have to leave your mouth open for a very long time before a roast chicken flys into it.” Early Proveb.

    Profile photo of grossrealisationgrossrealisation
    Member
    @grossrealisation
    Join Date: 2005
    Post Count: 1,031

    hi Rebecca2
    buy the book when you have your answer send me the book as I will make good use of it.
    1. there more then a couple of reasons for a trust and if you search this or a couple of other web site you will understand.
    a company and or trust is a structure that is use to move assets claim gst or adjust profit dispersions they are not some thing that can be answered very easily but every development I do I have a company with a trust underneithe that maybe a discretionary,unit, hybrid,family or bear trust and all have different uses this is not an area that is easily explained and must be setup ( from my point of veiw by a professional in that area.
    as for accountants lining there own pockets well you can set them up yourself and run them yourself they do not need an accountant( this I would definately not do as the accountant will save well inexcess of the cost if you use a good accountant I am very happy that robert sets mine up and sets them up to my requirement for that project)
    my .002

    here to help

    Profile photo of WASPWASP
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    @wasp
    Join Date: 2005
    Post Count: 51

    THATS what i want LOTS of pictures explaining things in laymans terms. Moreso i want a step by step book on the day to day running requirements [biggrin]

    has anyone read this one (looks interesting so far)Coastymike can you recommend any?

    Successful Trust Management
    $31.07 ex GST
    $34.95 incl GST

    **REVISED 2005 EDITION**

    The objective of this book is to provide easy-to-understand information about how to successfully set up and run a trust. It is also a guide for those people who have a trust and want to make sure it is run properly and successfully on their behalf.

    Successful Trust Management explains how to accomplish important financial objectives through establishing a trust as part of an asset protection programme. By doing this, you can achieve financial safety and protection, both during your lifetime and for those you wish to pass your successes to.

    Drawing on many years of experience as a trust lawyer, Ross Holmes gives explanations of the parties involved in setting up a trust, how to prepare a trust deed, what the different parts of a trust are and how to successfully structure a trust. his descriptions are supported and illustrated with the relevant court cases that guide trust law in New Zealand and Australia, as well as giving information about where to go for further information.

    or

    Success with Trusts
    $26.62 ex GST
    $29.95 incl GST

    Success with Trusts explores and explains the reasons for setting up an asset protection plan that utilises trusts, resulting in financial safety and protection both during your lifetime and for those you wish to pass your successes to. This book gives the keys to successful asset protection planning, giving advice and guidance on how to succeed through identifying risks, planning now, making your asset protection work, making your trust work, and success through recording and regularly updating your objectives

    or this one (I have Dales books, but am looking at these as well)

    Sham Trusts
    $26.62 ex GST
    $29.95 incl GST

    Everyone with a trust will need to purchase this book.

    Trusts have become increasingly popular over recent generations as a result of the expansion in personal wealth which has occurred during that period. If a trust is established and administered genuinely, as part of a comprehensive asset protection plan, it will assist you to achieve your objectives and prosper.

    Many trustees are unknowingly sitting on a time bomb as a result of the failure of advisors forming trusts to provide practical guidance on trust law, the running of trusts, or the duties of trustees. This has resulted in many trusts being either shams i.e. invalid, or a series of sham transactions. The sad fact is that in many such cases the advisors and trustees do not realise that they are shams.

    The myth that independent trustees must be appointed, is continuing to be expounded by advisors, resulting in further sham trusts or transactions. The same principles used to set aside trusts as shams are used to set aside companies as shams. Yet the advisors who maintain that independent trustees are necessary for credibility in the case of trusts, do not express the view that independent company directors are necessary for credibility in the case of private companies. The cases establish that far more trusts with independent trustees have been set aside as shams than trusts without independent trustees. This has occurred in many cases because of the failure, in practice, of many independent trustees to genuinely take part in decisions involving the trust, and a failure on the part of trustees to understand what a trust is, and how to exercise the duties of trustees. This in turn has often been caused by the absence of practical guidance from the advisors setting up the trusts.

    Many trusts are not set up as part of an asset protection plan with a strategy and a method of achieving that strategy. Just as business plans and investments plans without a strategy will fail to achieve the desired objective, so do trusts formed without an asset protection planning strategy.

    Wasp
    **************************************************

    Its not what you earn but what you do with what you earn

    Profile photo of grossrealisationgrossrealisation
    Member
    @grossrealisation
    Join Date: 2005
    Post Count: 1,031

    hi wasp
    very interesting I would like to know which are good also.
    are they old books or something dimics would have

    here to help

    Profile photo of TerrywTerryw
    Participant
    @terryw
    Join Date: 2001
    Post Count: 16,110

    Successful Trust Management (New Edition)
    Asset Protection Planning And the Administration of Trusts
    Ross Holmes
    http://www.reed.co.nz/title.cfm?titleid=3174

    Appears to be a NZ published book

    Terryw
    Discover Home Loans
    Parramatta
    [email protected]

    Terryw | Structuring Lawyers / Loan Structuring Pty Ltd
    http://propertytaxbook.com.au/
    Email Me

    Lawyer, Mortgage Broker and Tax Advisor (Aust wide) http://propertytaxbook.com.au/

    Profile photo of TerrywTerryw
    Participant
    @terryw
    Join Date: 2001
    Post Count: 16,110

    Success with Trusts
    How to Protect Your Assets with Trusts
    Ross Holmes

    Many people let financial planning slip into their ‘too hard’ basket. Such delays lessen the opportunity of ensuring that your important financial objectives are achieved, and increase the risk of occurrences that could prevent you from achieving your objectives.

    Success with Trusts explores and explains the reasons for setting up an asset protection plan that utilises trusts, resulting in financial safety and protection both during your lifetime and for those you wish to pass your successes to. This book gives the keys to successful asset protection planning, giving advice and guidance on how to succeed through identifying risks, planning now, making your asset protection work, making your trust work, and success through recording and regularly updating your objectives.

    Format: Paperback, 318 x 216 mm
    ISBN: 0 7900 0772 X
    Our price: $29.99
    Publication date: 26 October 2000

    http://www.reed.co.nz/products.cfm?view=755&catID=36

    same author as above

    Terryw
    Discover Home Loans
    Parramatta
    [email protected]

    Terryw | Structuring Lawyers / Loan Structuring Pty Ltd
    http://propertytaxbook.com.au/
    Email Me

    Lawyer, Mortgage Broker and Tax Advisor (Aust wide) http://propertytaxbook.com.au/

    Profile photo of TerrywTerryw
    Participant
    @terryw
    Join Date: 2001
    Post Count: 16,110

    Sham Trusts
    $26.62 ex GST

    Also appears to be a NZ published book.
    http://www.goodreturns.co.nz/books/product_info.php?products_id=24

    Terryw
    Discover Home Loans
    Parramatta
    [email protected]

    Terryw | Structuring Lawyers / Loan Structuring Pty Ltd
    http://propertytaxbook.com.au/
    Email Me

    Lawyer, Mortgage Broker and Tax Advisor (Aust wide) http://propertytaxbook.com.au/

    Profile photo of tom1000000tom1000000
    Participant
    @tom1000000
    Join Date: 2003
    Post Count: 74

    Hmmm a rather important question….

    If I buy one of these books can I claim it as a deduction on my tax return?

    And if I can which specific section of the Tax Pack applies (assume I’m doing my own return)?

    Profile photo of MIKALAMIKALA
    Member
    @mikala
    Join Date: 2005
    Post Count: 64

    Hi GR,
    Great idea.
    I for one would be willing to chip in to buy the book – I really need to learn a lot about trusts as I don’t understand them and wanted to know if they would suit our investment strategy. This is despite the fact that I have read Wealth Guardian – this seemed to create as many questions for me as answers so was not comprehensive enough.
    Anyone else coming to the Sydney meeting interested in chipping in ?

    Cheers

    MIKALA

    Profile photo of coastymikecoastymike
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    @coastymike
    Join Date: 2005
    Post Count: 125

    Might be able to make it. Where is it located and what time ? Do you know who else is going.

    If I do attend then I will bring along my copy of the 2005 Trust Structures Guide.

    Profile photo of coastymikecoastymike
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    @coastymike
    Join Date: 2005
    Post Count: 125

    Rebecca,

    Here is a little information with respect to trusts and how things work in the case of bankruptcy.

    Firstly a trustee is personally liable to creditors in respect of debts and liabilities incurred on behalf of the trust. It is a statutory right found in the trustee’s legislation in all States. The right to an indemnity provides the trustee with a right in the nature of an equitable lien or right over the assets of the trust. The creditors cannot make a claim against the assets of the trust but are subrogated to the trustee’s right to be indemnfied.

    So how does this provide protection. Well lets assume you run a business through a discretionary trust with a corporate trustee. Let’s also assume you have a separate discretionary trust with a different corporate trustee over your investment property. If in this case the business was sued the creditors will only have the right for the trustee to be indemnified over the business assets. Because the investment property has a different corporate trustee in a different trust then that investment asset is not available to the creditors. That is why a corporate trustee is the preferred entity as oppossed to an individual trustee. If you had two discretionary trusts and both had the same trustee then yes you could have a problem. The creditors might claim that they have a right to be indemnified not only against the assets of the business trust but also the assets of the investment trust. The risk is low but always subject to the Courts. However if the investment trust and business trust have two totally different trustees then the assets of one trust are effectively protected against claims made against the other trust. Thats the asset protection.

    Imagine that you are a business owner and have a company which you are also a director. The company is sued and they then sue the directors. Lets assume your investment assets are held in your individual name instead of in a separate trust with a separate trustee. Well you have a problem because the investment assets are the assets of the directors and available to the creditors when they take action against the directors. Not so when the investment assets are in a different trust with a different corporate trustee.

    That is why some people like to have a separate trust and sometimes even a separate corporate trustee for every investment type. I have some clients who have a separate trust for every single investment and also a separate corporate trustee. For the average person this may be overkill and in fact would be very expensive. However for others it provides a secure peace of mind.

    At a minimum however I would always suggest keeping your business assets and investment assets in two separate structures. Good asset protection.

    There are also advantages with respect to streaming of income as suggested by gross, the refinancing principle which is rarely discussed and sometimes even more importantly the estate planning issues.

    Profile photo of rebecca2rebecca2
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    @rebecca2
    Join Date: 2003
    Post Count: 54

    I love you guys, you have helped heaps

    Beck.
    “You have to leave your mouth open for a very long time before a roast chicken flys into it.” Early Proveb.

    Profile photo of rebecca2rebecca2
    Member
    @rebecca2
    Join Date: 2003
    Post Count: 54

    I love you guys, you have helped heaps.

    Beck.
    “You have to leave your mouth open for a very long time before a roast chicken flys into it.” Early Proveb.

    Profile photo of grossrealisationgrossrealisation
    Member
    @grossrealisation
    Join Date: 2005
    Post Count: 1,031

    hi coastymike
    the meeting is on at petersham rsl
    at 4,00pm
    the address is 7 regent st petersham
    behind marrickville council and has two car parks.
    I have acompany called mint that will be comming and they are sending me a time slot for there subjects but we want to try and have different groups.
    there was about 30 last time and hope to get the same this time

    here to help

    Profile photo of gatsbygatsby
    Member
    @gatsby
    Join Date: 2003
    Post Count: 708

    Hi Terry,
    Thanks for posting the new book on Trust Structures.
    Kind regards,
    Gatsby.

    “Sometimes the hardest thing to do in life is often the best thing to do.”

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