All Topics / Help Needed! / Vendor finance offer on rural property?

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  • Profile photo of mazza007mazza007
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    @mazza007
    Join Date: 2013
    Post Count: 5

    Hello all,

    This is my first post and I'm no real estate expert, so thanks in advance for any advice!

    I'm looking at a four hundred acre property. Its been on the market for at least 6 months, initially at $350,00 and now reduced to $320,00. This is realestate.com.au price!

    I really want this property, its beautiful, its not just an investment , it would be my place to retire to one day.

    There is current subdivision approval to split it into a 100 acre and a 300 acre lot.

    I'm going to talk to the development consent authority to see if they would approve 10 or 20 acre lots for subdivision instead as they are a lot easier to sell (plus the 100 acre lot is gorgeous so i wouldn't sell that anyway) You really cant buy 20 acres for less than 200K up here so it wouldn't take much to pay for the property, just subdivide off 3 x 20 acre lots.

    At this point I can probably rustle up 50 or 60K deposit,

    I do have an IP which Im planning to sell next year (to avoid CGT) which should make me about 150K profit but I reall dont want to sell it this year.

    I am assuming that I will need twenty percent deposit for finance and it still may not be possible.  I make about 130K but I'm self-employed so that doesnt help.

    Any ideas which banks will do this sort of finance? Would it help to document my smaller lots subdivision plan? Or just go with "yep i'm going to do that 100 acre subdivision" ?

    Im half tempted to see if the owner will take vendor finance (he's pretty desperate to sell) but the I cant subdivide till I hold the title, yes?

    So thats my questions. 1. Where can I go for finance for this?

                                               2. Is there any advantage to vendor finance or should Iat least  try the banks first?

    Thanks for reading so far!

    Cheers

    Mazza

    Profile photo of RPIRPI
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    @rpi
    Join Date: 2012
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    Vendor finance in rural areas is very common

    RPI | Certus Legal Group / PRO Town Planners
    http://www.certuslegal.com.au
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    Property Lawyer & Town Planner

    Profile photo of mazza007mazza007
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    @mazza007
    Join Date: 2013
    Post Count: 5

    Thanks for that! I thought it would be because its so hard to get anything out of the banks. So would it be silly to  just approach the owner first and not even bother with the run around from the banks?

    What's a reasonable offer? Would something like K300, 60K deposit, the rest over 5 years, be reasonable?

    Profile photo of Paul DobsonPaul Dobson
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    Hi Mazza

    As Darryl says, vendor financing (VF) of rural properties never lost its popularity with rural communities.  Unlike residential areas, were banks jumped into the market in the 80's and VF is only slowly increasing in popularity again.

    If I were in your shoes, I'd be talking directly with the seller.  As you say, after such a long time on the market s/he's probably keen to get 'something' going.  For starters how about offering to buy the property with a vendor finance Instalment Contract (sometimes called a Terms Contract).  Possibly offer a $50K deposit and payments over 20 or 30 years.  You may not get that long but it's worth trying to get as long as you can.

    Let us know what State you're in and we can direct you to a vendor finance savvy solicitor to draw up the Instalment Contract.

    Also, because it's a rural property it should not be regulated by the National Credit Code.  As necessary, this could allow you to offer a 5 year Instalment Contract with a balloon payment at the end of the term for the remainder of the balance owing.

    This is a very flexible way to buy this type of property and just about anything you and the Seller agree to should be able to be included in the Contract.

    Regarding the development application, I'd show the current seller that the earlier I get the DA approved, the earlier s/he will get paid out.  You could even offer a financial inducement to the seller when the DA is approved.

    Good luck and welcome to the forum.

    Cheers,  Paul

    Paul Dobson | Vendor Finance Institute
    http://www.vendorfinanceinstitute.com.au
    Email Me | Phone Me

    An alternative way to finance your home.

    Profile photo of mazza007mazza007
    Member
    @mazza007
    Join Date: 2013
    Post Count: 5

    Thanks Paul,

    I'm pretty new to this, so apologies for my confusion!

      I was under the impression that I wouldn't be able to do the subdivision until I held the title i.e. I had paid the owner entirely for the property. Or is there a way I can get subdivision approval and sell those twenty acres lots to pay the owner out?

    I am assuming the reason he hasn't done them is because he's short of funds ,he would have to know that 100 acres is not a good size to sell.  His subdivision application is just using the existing road and power pole.  I'm happy to offer him financial incentive on the subdivision, just confused how it would work!

    I'm in the NT. Yes please, solicitor recommendation would be very helpful.

    Cheers

    Mazza

    Profile photo of FreckleFreckle
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    @freckle
    Join Date: 2012
    Post Count: 1,680

    You could also throw an options strategy in there blended with the VF vehicle. 

    You buy and option (but not an obligation) to purchase the property at a later date at above his asking price. You do the DA prep work. Once you're happy it's a goer and you perhaps have buyers lined up you execute the option.

    He gets a few bob for the option, say an extra 5k on price and an income off the VF component until you've sold the lot.

    You get to secure it now for bugger all 1-2k maybe and reduce your risk (time to watch the market, get the DA ready to roll and confirmed its a goer, and with a bit of luck you have time to do a bit of marketing to prospective buyers) You take your 100acre block and pay for that while he VF's the rest until sold. 

    You get much lower financing pressures, profit into offset accounts and you might just sell your other IP over this time frame.

    All going well you've got 100 acres for bugger all and a pocket full of cash (less tax of course)

    Profile photo of Paul DobsonPaul Dobson
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    @pauldobson
    Join Date: 2003
    Post Count: 1,196

    Hi Mazza

    As Freckle says, using a vendor finance Option strategy could also work very well.  Regarding the DA, you would put in all the work and cost of the DA application and the seller, i.e. the Title holder, will authorise (sign) all the DA application paperwork.

    A vendor finance savvy solicitor in the NT is:

    Vincent Close

    Barrister & Solicitor

    Unit 39 Metro Building, 21 Cavenagh Street, Darwin NT 0800

    GPO Box 3411, Darwin NT 9801

    Phone: 08 8941 7055

    Email: [email protected]

    Cheers,  Paul

    Paul Dobson | Vendor Finance Institute
    http://www.vendorfinanceinstitute.com.au
    Email Me | Phone Me

    An alternative way to finance your home.

    Profile photo of mazza007mazza007
    Member
    @mazza007
    Join Date: 2013
    Post Count: 5

    Thanks Freckle, Thanks Paul,

    Lots to think about there, 

      I'll go have a chat to the DA and the solicitor and see how I go.

    Thanks so much for your  advice, I'll let you know how it goes!

    Profile photo of TerrywTerryw
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    @terryw
    Join Date: 2001
    Post Count: 16,213

    You might find LVR with a bank is much more limited than you expected. Maybe 60% LVR. Interest rate could be high too.

    Why not try to fnd out what the vendor paid for it and when. This may enable you to estmiate what his mortgage is.He is likely to need cash enough to let him discharge the mortgage and the rest could be a loan to you – possibly.

    Terryw | Structuring Lawyers Pty Ltd / Loan Structuring Pty Ltd
    http://www.Structuring.com.au
    Email Me

    Lawyer, Mortgage Broker and Tax Advisor (Sydney based but advising Aust wide) http://www.Structuring.com.au

    Profile photo of mazza007mazza007
    Member
    @mazza007
    Join Date: 2013
    Post Count: 5

    Thanks Terry,

    Yep,I'm pretty sure he's had this property for enough years that he wouldn't have paid much for it. 

    Any idea how I can find out how much he paid? Is that sort of info on record somewhere?

    Cheers

    Mazza

    Profile photo of TerrywTerryw
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    @terryw
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    Do a title search to get the transfer number and then get a copy of the transfer. Try landtiles office website.

    Terryw | Structuring Lawyers Pty Ltd / Loan Structuring Pty Ltd
    http://www.Structuring.com.au
    Email Me

    Lawyer, Mortgage Broker and Tax Advisor (Sydney based but advising Aust wide) http://www.Structuring.com.au

    Profile photo of Jeff123Jeff123
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    @jeff123
    Join Date: 2012
    Post Count: 31

    If the vendor is desperate to sell then I'd certainly try and find out what he paid for it and when (as others here have suggested).  Then open a dialog with him and see what can be negotiated.  Maybe VF is a realistic option in this instance, and if you can negotiate the terms then more's the power.  Good luck, I'll be interested to know what transpires!

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