All Topics / Help Needed! / I want to buy a property and offer a long settlement ??? how???

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  • Profile photo of TaylorChangTaylorChang
    Participant
    @scha9799
    Join Date: 2009
    Post Count: 234

    Hi all,

    I would like to make an offer on a property in NSW

    But I don't have enough deposit right now. My finance and deposit will be ready in 7 month.

    I am thinking to put an offer for long term settlement ( at leaset 7 months)

    Once my offer is accepted and contract exchange, then I have 7 months to settle the property.

    Questions:

    1)When does legal ownership take place ? on exchange date or settlement date ?

    2)Do I liable to pay stamp duty on the exchange date or settlement date ?

    3)If on the exchange date the contract is under my name, but after contract exchange and before settlement I decide to take another person as joint venture partner. Can my JV partner be on the property title as well or the JV partner has to be found before exchange date to be on the property title ???

    5) is there any limit ( min or max days) for the cooling off period ?  or as long as both buyer and seller are happy any period is ok ???

    4) for the deposit in NSW is there any minimum deposit amount need to pay on the exchange date ? or as long as both buyer and seller are happy any amount is ok ??

    5)If a contract have exchanged but before settlement, I found another buyer wants to buy the property. I then slip it to the new buyer. Does the new buyer has to pay stamp duty ?  Do I have to pay stamp duty ?

    Thank in advance

    TaylorChang | Finance Broker
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    Profile photo of mrhetmrhet
    Member
    @mrhet
    Join Date: 2012
    Post Count: 2

    Hi

     You could go to a bank that you have a good relationship with, and ask for a deposit bond (these are not free and you will have to pay the bank some commission for it), this is considered a deposit. 

    I have used this in the past, but not sure how banks look at this now during the GFC.  However, this is a binding contract with the Bank (unless cooling off ) and must not be done unless you are guaranteed that you will have available funds to meet the deposit at a specified date.

      Once you sign a contract to purchase a property and pay  deposit  it is binding, unless you put some types of special conditions in there, and these should be worded by your legal representative and not the Real Estate Agent. These must be specific and not leave any room for doubt about what the conditions are for.

    Contracts will then become binding once these conditions are met.  stamp duty willgenerally be taken out of your account once settlement has gone through and these funds must be available in the account the bank sets up for the loan, or check with your lender for their requirements.

    Settlement is when the discharging bank and the incoming bank meet to exchange money on the contract and the title is exchanged with your name on it, and the bank listed as Encumberance on the Certificate of Title.

    Buying a property on a long settlement is possible, but for the seller (Vendor) it is not something they may want to consider, unless

         1) You are willing to pay full asking price for the property

        2)  Your offer is unconditional or with as little conditions as possible

         3)  They already have a property in mind, and are not in any hurry to move.

    Buying a property as one person and then nominating another person, company or trust is possible if you wish to nominate and or/nominees as Purchaser in the Sale of Contract.  This can be risky for the Vendor as they cannot identify who the Purchasers' are however, the original Purchaser remains liable under the contract.  Stamp duty may be payable by the original Purchaser if they stand to make a profit from the property,  from changing or nominating a new Purchaser.  Solicitors or Conveyancers' will get a nominated Purchaser/Company or Trust to fill out a Statutory Declaration form which they then sign.  A company who is nominated will generally be expected to provide a Company Seal document with those authorised as Directors signing it so make sure you have the authority to act on whoever you wish to nominate.

    Cooling off periods apply these are some of them, but you should check with your legal representative and the Contract

      a) the property is not sold at public auction or within the same business day after auction

      b) the property is 2.5 hectares or more

      c) a Section 66W certificate is given to the Purchaser and they sign it thereby waiving their cooling off rights

    There are other cooling off rights and variances which can also be varied or withdrawn if certain conditions are met.  For example the right to cool off is not added to the contract as part of the Sale and the Purchaser is not made aware of it, in this case the Purchaser can rescind right up to settlement day and they do not lose part of their deposit (eg 0.25%)

    Cooling off conditions should not be taken lightly and must meet strict conditions, the Law at present allows 5 business days after signing of the Contracts and start immediately you sign the Contract not including weekends and public holidays. 

    If the contract is ended because some special condition is not met there is no requirement to pay the penalty clause of 0.25% of the deposit.  

    A property can be purchased at whatever the Purchaser is willing to accept as a deposit,  however the usual amount is usually 10%, this generally covers the Vendors' agents fees, and also what they take the penalty of 0.25% if you cool off.  It also makes it more attractive to the Vendor as this gives them surety that the purchaser is genuine.  Sometimes contracts can vary these terms and these need to be agreed to by the Vendor and Purchaser.  In NSW a deposit must be paid and contracts exchanged to make the contract legal.

    DISCLAIMER

    I do not promise that these are all the conditions that are relevant to your contract and only a Solicitor or licensed Conveyancer in NSW can advise you of these once you have the Sale of Contract relevant to the property you wish to buy and the information supplied may or may not be relevant to you and should not be used as legal and binding advice. The information I have given has been based on genuine property purchases that have involved these or similar terms and I do not claim to give you legal advice as most of the information here can be considered General Information and can be checked using the NSW Office of Fair Trading Buying a Property

    These conditions are only relative to residential property and do not apply to the Sale of Commercial Property.

    So please check any Contract over with your legal representative before signing anything

    Good luck 

    Profile photo of TheFinanceShopTheFinanceShop
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    @thefinanceshop
    Join Date: 2012
    Post Count: 1,271

    1. Settlement

    2. Settlement

    3. Not that easy. You either need to get the vendor to agree to the change or get your solicitor to organise a stat dec for the transfer of entities. I went through something similar last week and its an absolute pain. The purchasor was also whacked with a $7k bill from his solicitor for the 'extra work'.

    4. Depends but usually 10 days. You can sign a 66w and waive the cooling off period but I do not recommend this

    5. Need to clarify what you mean

    TheFinanceShop | Elite Property Finance
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    Profile photo of PLCPLC
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    @plc
    Join Date: 2012
    Post Count: 400

    In regards to onselling the property before settlement, recently my sister bought property from someone who was onselling to her before settlement. The original buyer was trying to sell at a small profit but was told that if that was case, then both he and my sister would pay stamp duty, however if it was onsold at the same price as what it was originally bought for, then only my sister would pay the stamp duty. Considering the small profit would have left the original buyer in the same financial state after stamp duty, he decided to onsell for the same price as the original purchase and incurred no stamp duty as a result.

    PLC | Phoenix Loan Consulting
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    Profile photo of Paul DobsonPaul Dobson
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    @pauldobson
    Join Date: 2003
    Post Count: 1,196

    Just a small point regarding the payment of Stamp Duty in NSW.  Unlike Vic where it's payable on transfer of Title, in NSW it's payable within 90 days of 'exchange' of Contracts.  In Qld it's within 30 days of 'exchange'.

    Cheers,  Paul

    Paul Dobson | Vendor Finance Institute
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    An alternative way to finance your home.

    Profile photo of Jacqui MiddletonJacqui Middleton
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    @jacm
    Join Date: 2009
    Post Count: 2,539

    1) Legal ownership takes place at settlement, but obligation takes place after the cooling period is over and all special conditions (such as finance) are satisfied.

    2) In VIC, stamp duty is payable at settlement.

    3) If you put "Joe Bloggs and/or nominee" as the buyer on the contract of sale, you don't have to worry about the precise name or names until close to settlement.  (Joe Bloggs should be replaced with your name).

    Cooling off period is a fixed period of time as per real estate law.  There is no cooling off period for the vendor but there is for the buyer.  I believe it is 3 days.

    4) Deposit is indeed negotiable.

    5) In VIC the both of you would pay stamp duty.  I am not 100% sure about other states.  That said, if you had and/or nominee on the contract of sale the situation might be slightly different.  I am sure someone more in the know about such things will comment.

    Now here is my opinion;

    I don't think it is a particularly good idea to put something under contract if you will not be eligible for finance for another 7 months.  While you might get agreement on a long settlement, the vendor is not going to let you mess about trying to get a bank loan for 7 months.  They'll give you around 4 weeks max.  So in a nutshell I don't see the vendor agreeing to a 7mth finance clause which means you could not buy the property under your current plan.

    Jacqui Middleton | Middleton Buyers Advocates
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    Profile photo of TerrywTerryw
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    @terryw
    Join Date: 2001
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    Some incorrect information in the answers above. Make sure you get proper legal advice before signing any contracts.

    Although stamp duty may become payable at settlement or within 3 months you actually become liable for it on exchange of contracts.

    Terryw | Structuring Lawyers Pty Ltd / Loan Structuring Pty Ltd
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    Profile photo of TerrywTerryw
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    @terryw
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    Here are my answers

    1. Legal ownership changes at settlement, but you would have a beneficial interest in the property at exchange.

    2. In NSW the stamp duty is payable within 3 months of contract date or at settlement whichever is earlier

    3. This would be treated as a sub sale so both you and the new person would pay stamp duty – unless a family member under some circumstances.

    4. No min

    5. Both pay

    _________________

    Terryw | Structuring Lawyers Pty Ltd / Loan Structuring Pty Ltd
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    Profile photo of DerekDerek
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    @derek
    Join Date: 2004
    Post Count: 3,544

    Looking at this another way.

    Someone has listed their property to sell.

    Most vendors prefer a quicker sale rather than a stretched out sale as per your initial question.

    You don't yet have sufficient deposit.

    I can see very, very few vendors accepting such an offer.

    Methinks you are better getting finance in place and then look for a property. Sure this may take a few months & sure you may miss this one but there are 'lots' of properties in the market at the moment.

    Profile photo of CatalystCatalyst
    Participant
    @catalyst
    Join Date: 2008
    Post Count: 1,404

    Sounds like you're keen to start your property adventure but really-

    If you don't have any deposit and haven't been approved for finance who in their right mind would sell you a property and wait 7 months in the hope that you can follow through on the contract?

    Profile photo of Richard TaylorRichard Taylor
    Participant
    @qlds007
    Join Date: 2003
    Post Count: 12,024

    The guys have seemed to covered all of your question so I wont repeat what has been posted already.

    Only consideration would be on the finance side under NCCP the letter of offer from your potential lender would have expired after 90 days and therefore the deal may need to be re-assessed. If you had a change in circumstances or the lender has a change in credit policy (I have one on my desk in a similar situation) you may find that finance wasn't approved second time around yet you still have to settle.

    You need to be aware of this.

    Cheers

    Yours in Finance

    Richard Taylor | Australia's leading private lender

    Profile photo of waggacitywaggacity
    Member
    @waggacity
    Join Date: 2013
    Post Count: 1

    I am in the reverse situation of being a seller who actually wants a 6-month settlement on the sale.

    Because i am locked into a fixed rate loan until Feb 2014.

    I guess there are sellers in a similar situation to me. Having said that i agree with the other posters as to the inherent risk.

    Profile photo of Jamie MooreJamie Moore
    Participant
    @jamie-m
    Join Date: 2010
    Post Count: 5,069

    Hiya Waggacity

    Welcome aboard.

    Just work that into your settlement negotiations – if it's an investor purchasing the property they might be happy to agree to a longer settlement. 

    Have you called your lender to suss out what the break costs would be?

    Cheers

    Jamie

    Jamie Moore | Pass Go Home Loans Pty Ltd
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