Hello Everyone.
My friend's tenants had vacated some months ago, but she keeps receiving their outstanding utilities bills. She asked the utility company to stop sending the bills to the property numerous times, but her requests were never actioned. In the end she had to approach the Ombudsman office, who told her that she was responsible to get the tenant to pay, of which she already tried a few times without success. The Ombudsman office said that she was obliged to provide the tenant's details to the utility company as it was not a breach of privacy since the tenant was hers and left without paying the bills. And that if she failed to provide the details, she would be responsible for the debt (or the debt is issued against the property).
IAre the above correct? My friend felt like she was being threatened. She said it was unfair that the onus was on her to provide the tenant's details and to carry the debt. Could the tenant sue her for breach of privacy if my friend provides her ex-tenant's details? Secondly even if she did provide the details as demanded, and they still cannot reach the tenants (due to perhaps the tenants not answering, not returning calls, or had moved elsewhere altogether), would my friend be responsible to carry the debt?
Last question, what if my friend doesn't pay, and the utility company keeps sending the bills to the property, addressed to "Unknown User" or "The Occupant", could the utility company one day place a lien against the property?
Any advice would be greatly appreciated, as I said my friend felt that she was being threatened and pressured.
Thank you in advance.
Regards,
Jenny111
I had a year of utilities bills sent to the incorrect address – they were water bills that were sent to the IP address (instead of my address).
It was agreed the tenant would pay the water bills but they never bothered – and I simply assumed all was being looked after because I never heard otherwise (that's because all of the late notices were being sent to the wrong address).
After the tenant took off – I found out I had a $2k water bill. Not a whole lot I could do but pay for it – tenant was nowhere to be found and technically it was my responsibility to ensure that the account was looked after.
Cheers
Jamie
Jamie Moore | Pass Go Home Loans Pty Ltd
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If the Ombudsman has told your friend what she needs to do, what is the problem? Just follow the instructions and hand over the tenant details.
Setting this aside though, I don't get it. How can the utility company set up an account without a name? It makes no sense. I'd chat to Consumer Affairs about it also.
Jacqui Middleton | Middleton Buyers Advocates
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Email Me | Phone MeVIC Buyers' Agents for investors, home buyers & SMSFs.
I heard that these tenants liked to take just about every things to court. When they were at the property, every little things that were slightly not to their satisfaction, they threatened to take my friend to the tribunal.
Was your friend self managing and were the bills in tenants or your friends name?
Water accounts for my properties are all in my name – I pay and then get reimbursement from tenants via property manager. If tenant vacates PM does a water reading and retains portion of bond money pending arrival of water authority bill.
I pay the bill to make sure there is no harm done to my credit rating. If it means I am out of pocket a little (never happened yet) then that is but a small price to pay for good credit.
jenny111 wrote:I heard that these tenants liked to take just about every things to court. When they were at the property, every little things that were slightly not to their satisfaction, they threatened to take my friend to the tribunal.yes but that has nothing to do with these bills. Your friend needs to stay focussed on the issue of only the bills and work with the ombudsman on the matter.
Jacqui Middleton | Middleton Buyers Advocates
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Email Me | Phone MeVIC Buyers' Agents for investors, home buyers & SMSFs.
She said the bills were addressed to 'Unknown Consumer' or "The Occupant". This was because the utility company stuffed up the transfer and had the wrong name. They deleted the name but still send the bills to the property, addressing to nobody. The tenants said they never authorised the transfer.
Your friend doesn't have a contract with the electricity company so they are unlikely be to liable for the tenants bills. I cannot think of any circumstances where they could be liable.
Privacy is a different matter. I am not sure of the answer but would request the ombudsman to provide the request in writing and to 'compell' you to provide the details and under what basis of law you are compelled. Under the privacy act you may be exempt from the requirement to keep privacy details from release if compelled by law. Privacy Act also may not even apply in this situation.
Terryw | Structuring Lawyers Pty Ltd / Loan Structuring Pty Ltd
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To my knowledge, in NSW, if the utility company decided to advance credit to the tenant, and you are not a guarantor, then the tenant default is the utility company's debt to pursue with the tenant, not with the property or property owner.
You were not given any opportunity to approve the tenant's level of credit or debt, or to check their credit worthiness before allowing them to run up a debt with the utility company, that was done by the utility company, nothing to do with you.
Don't be bluffed into paying.
You can always ask the utility company which document or agreement signed by you would they be relying on to argue that the debt is yours e.g. supply contract.
Def agree with TerryW to obtain written demand from Ombudsman quoting the act under which you are required by law to comply. Then you can check with the Privacy Commissioner before providing tenant details. CYA at all times.
Cheers
thecrest
thecrest | Tony Neale - Statewide Motel Brokers
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What does 'to compell you to provide the details' and 'CYA at all times' mean?, please.
jenny111 wrote:What does 'to compell you to provide the details' and 'CYA at all times' mean?, please.Compel, as in legally required to do so.
Terryw | Structuring Lawyers Pty Ltd / Loan Structuring Pty Ltd
http://www.Structuring.com.au
Email MeLawyer, Mortgage Broker and Tax Advisor (Sydney based but advising Aust wide) http://www.Structuring.com.au
From some of the comments in this thread it sounds like the account originally was held in the name of the owner and they called to have it switched to the tenant (perhaps by means of adding them as an extra onto the account), as opposed to opening a new and separate account??? Not sure if this is what occurred and if so if it makes a difference to the outcome…
Jacqui Middleton | Middleton Buyers Advocates
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Email Me | Phone MeVIC Buyers' Agents for investors, home buyers & SMSFs.
The account was definitely in the tenants name. They aware that they had to connect the utility in their when they first moved in.
Thanks, Terry.
I moved out of a shared rental when i was younger. I had the electricity bill in my name. I moved out and just before I called the electricity company to say I was but my house mate was staying. They said she had one month to call them and put it in her name otherwise it would be disconnected.
Over 12 months later I got a letter from a debt collector saying pay now or my credit will be affected! My housemate never put her name on the bill and they stayed on for 6 months or something.
I called the company and they said I was responsible for following them up (the electricity company) to check my housemate had done so.
I was dumbfounded. I argued that I was never told I had to check on them to see if they were doing their job properly. I said how I was told the account would be disconnected if no new name was added. They kept saying like an automated robot that I should have rang and checked.
So, I had to just pay. being chased my debt collectors was not a nice feeling!!
I was 19 and at uni so it was a real kick in the guts.
My point is in relation to the above posts, that I was a tenant, and I was held liable, not the owner.
The golden rule of living in share housing: make sure someone else carries the burden of having their name on the bills… Not you
Jacqui Middleton | Middleton Buyers Advocates
http://www.middletonbuyersadvocates.com.au
Email Me | Phone MeVIC Buyers' Agents for investors, home buyers & SMSFs.
Thanks, Everyone.
Legal advice received by my friend was that she would not need to do anything as she would not be liable for the debt of or utility consumed by the tenants.
Regards,
Jenny111.
Thanks for touching base with us to let us know how it panned out Jenny
Good result. It did seem odd the utility company was trying to bully her into paying an account held in someone else's name.Jacqui Middleton | Middleton Buyers Advocates
http://www.middletonbuyersadvocates.com.au
Email Me | Phone MeVIC Buyers' Agents for investors, home buyers & SMSFs.
Good result. It did seem odd the utility company was trying to bully her into paying an account held in someone else's name.You must be logged in to reply to this topic. If you don't have an account, you can register here.
