All Topics / Help Needed! / My situation, Who is in the know?

Viewing 19 posts - 1 through 19 (of 19 total)
  • Profile photo of Benni BrialsBenni Brials
    Participant
    @benni-brials
    Join Date: 2011
    Post Count: 5

    Hi all,

    First post here so I thought I would make it down to the point.

    I am 22 working in the mines. I have little outgoings and make just over 120k before tax. My partner and myself wish to leave the mines in 5-6 years to move back to a nice town down south. Only one problem, my 120k salary will go to about 50-75 before tax, this sucks and I am looking to aggressively invest to ensure a future where I will not be scraping through. Please I am not looking for anybody who says its not possible, if that is your outlook i dont want to hear it. If you have solutions and steps to achieve this then I am all ears. I have no bad debt, 10k in the bank, and about 40k+ in assets (car, motorbike, computer etc) I am wondering what investment plans you all would think I should be looking at, especially with a focus in the next 5-6 years, I want to generate about 6k a month positive cashflow and still have some capital investments earning long term growth.

    What do you all think? any ideas?

    Thanks for all your hard work, i am glad im asking the experts.

    Benni Brials

    Profile photo of Paul DobsonPaul Dobson
    Participant
    @pauldobson
    Join Date: 2003
    Post Count: 1,196

    Hi Benni

    Welcome to the forum.  We hope you enjoy your time here.

    Your serviceability for a loan looks reasonable but your $10K looks a bit low as a deposit.  All the excellent finance professionals on the forum may have a way around this for you.  One possibility is the help of family that may go guarantor for you?

    With your serviceability and $10K deposit plus the FHOG you could probably get into a property that's being sold with vendor finance (VF).  The upside of this is you're "in" the market but the downside is you usually pay a premium price for a VF property.  If you'd like to research what's available with VF have a look at:
    http://www.renttoownhome.com.au  and
    http://www.vendorfinancedirectory.com.au

    I have no interest in these sites, other than advertising there.  Good luck with your plan.

    Cheers,  Paul

    Paul Dobson | Vendor Finance Institute
    http://www.vendorfinanceinstitute.com.au
    Email Me | Phone Me

    An alternative way to finance your home.

    Profile photo of mik.mik.
    Member
    @mik.
    Join Date: 2011
    Post Count: 3

    Hi Paul,

    I am new to this forum but have been reading up on topics the last couple months as well as doing plenty research into getting my second IP. I purchased my first IP a year ago with the help of my parents so I didn’t need a deposit as they paid for everything using equity in their own homes. I am looking at different options and VF through websites like the ones you mentioned seems like a good idea. Do you know where Id be able to get more information about purchasing through VF as Id like to know more about how it will affect my future investing, for eg. can I stil use the CG on these properties as leverage for another down the track etc..

    BTW thanks for the informative posts as well, sites like this are great!

    Profile photo of Benni BrialsBenni Brials
    Participant
    @benni-brials
    Join Date: 2011
    Post Count: 5

    Thanks Paul and Mik,

    I doubt I will Vendor finance, This being because it will never be my PPOR, I will see if I can get some coin lent from the folks to start me off.  I was thinking about going:

    In my first year: 1 Cashflow positive and 1 negative (they even each other out)
    Second: 2 Cashflow positive and 1 negative (Start getting some extra coin)
    Third: 3 Cashflow Positive and 2 Negative (Long Term View to wealth creation)
    Fourth: 4 Cashflow Positive and 3 Negative (Start Building a Portfolio)
    Fifth: 5 Cashflow Positive and  5 Negative. (Even and Developing from there)

    So in total after 5 Years I would have- 15 Cashflow Positive and 12 Cashflow Negative Properties.

    The reason I would get more Cashflow Positivie Properties is that if I could display to the banks that I have constant growth and am not losing any money would i be able to still borrow to invest?

    Brials

    Profile photo of Jacqui MiddletonJacqui Middleton
    Participant
    @jacm
    Join Date: 2009
    Post Count: 2,539

    Wow your folks must have a lot of spare coin to be loaning!

    Might be worth considering a different approach such as:

    Borrow money from parents to buy IP #1.
    Pay them back asap.  You don't want ill feelings re money with your parents.
    While you are paying them, IP #1 is growing in value.
    After a year or so, you can use the growth in value (equity) in IP #1 as deposit for IP #2.
    Repeat this equity leveraging process over and over again.

    Growth alone will not impress the bank, no.  They will always want to see that you have income for repayments.

    Jacqui Middleton | Middleton Buyers Advocates
    http://www.middletonbuyersadvocates.com.au
    Email Me | Phone Me

    VIC Buyers' Agents for investors, home buyers & SMSFs.

    Profile photo of Benni BrialsBenni Brials
    Participant
    @benni-brials
    Join Date: 2011
    Post Count: 5

    I understand what you are saying,

    I am currently in the process of buying land and building in a town in WA, once built, the house will have made just over 150k in Capital Gains in leaa than a year. that will be my deposit for my CF+ house and that will be how i will start.
     
    I realise i didnt explain it as well as i should have

    Profile photo of Jacqui MiddletonJacqui Middleton
    Participant
    @jacm
    Join Date: 2009
    Post Count: 2,539

    Perfect  !  You're on your way !

    Be sure the cf+ property has good growth too.

    Jacqui Middleton | Middleton Buyers Advocates
    http://www.middletonbuyersadvocates.com.au
    Email Me | Phone Me

    VIC Buyers' Agents for investors, home buyers & SMSFs.

    Profile photo of Mick CMick C
    Participant
    @shape
    Join Date: 2010
    Post Count: 1,099
    Benni Brials wrote:
    Hi all,

    First post here so I thought I would make it down to the point.

    I am 22 working in the mines. I have little outgoings and make just over 120k before tax. My partner and myself wish to leave the mines in 5-6 years to move back to a nice town down south. Only one problem, my 120k salary will go to about 50-75 before tax, this sucks and I am looking to aggressively invest to ensure a future where I will not be scraping through. Please I am not looking for anybody who says its not possible, if that is your outlook i dont want to hear it. If you have solutions and steps to achieve this then I am all ears. I have no bad debt, 10k in the bank, and about 40k+ in assets (car, motorbike, computer etc) I am wondering what investment plans you all would think I should be looking at, especially with a focus in the next 5-6 years, I want to generate about 6k a month positive cashflow and still have some capital investments earning long term growth.

    What do you all think? any ideas?

    Thanks for all your hard work, i am glad im asking the experts.

    Benni Brials

    Hi,

    Your strenght: ( from what i can see so far in your post)
    1. good income

    Weakness:( from what i can see so far in your post)
    1. Low deposit

    Not a lot of info…but we can work with that :)

    My suggestion is to save up a decent deposit first- around $20-30k and buy in a good and known location where there is sure to be capital growth, it will be negative geared that’s for sure…so why buy a -ve place when you want a 6k passive income in 5 years time you ask???
    Because; most +ve properties have low growth, and since your earning a good income of 120k you wont need +ve properties for now…what you need is a “foundation property” as your first IP + tax benefit from the -Ve.

    So this is how it would roughly work out( By the way this is how i personally invested- living at home at that time etc)

    Year 1
    IP 1 – Buy good growth area ( established area), would most likely be -ve; claim the tax benefit + you can afford the lost because of your high income, you wont have this luxury when you move back town.

    Year 2 ( will take you some time to save up again)
    IP 2- If you have enough deposit- buy another good location property also -ve

    Year 3 ( hopefully property 1 has gone up! -)
    Draw on equity from Property 1 to fund this next investment– depending on your financial you may want to start going towards +ve properties now
    IP 3 – Area with good +ve
    Ip4- Area with Good +vE

    Year 4-5
    Buy what you can afford,
    Sell Property 1 or 2 ( if it has gone up by 30% ~ 8% per year)

    Of course this advice is general in nature :) But the whole point is to :
    1. Understand the REASON behind each purchase
    2. Timing – when to buy a +ve and a -ve to suit YOU GOAL
    3. Have a exit strategy.
    4. Lastly loan structure is important to achieve what you want…ie if you did a fix rate for say 4 -5year for IP 1 —- you would limit the way you can “draw on the equity” – so Build and find a good team of Professional that is willing to work for YOU.

    Regards
    Michael

    Mick C | Shape Home Loans
    http://www.shapehomeloans.com.au/
    Email Me | Phone Me

    Same Banks. Better Rates. Served With a Passion.

    Profile photo of Mick CMick C
    Participant
    @shape
    Join Date: 2010
    Post Count: 1,099
    Benni Brials wrote:

    Thanks Paul and Mik,

    I doubt I will Vendor finance, This being because it will never be my PPOR, I will see if I can get some coin lent from the folks to start me off.  I was thinking about going:

    In my first year: 1 Cashflow positive and 1 negative (they even each other out)
    Second: 2 Cashflow positive and 1 negative (Start getting some extra coin)
    Third: 3 Cashflow Positive and 2 Negative (Long Term View to wealth creation)
    Fourth: 4 Cashflow Positive and 3 Negative (Start Building a Portfolio)
    Fifth: 5 Cashflow Positive and  5 Negative. (Even and Developing from there)

    So in total after 5 Years I would have- 15 Cashflow Positive and 12 Cashflow Negative Properties.

    The reason I would get more Cashflow Positivie Properties is that if I could display to the banks that I have constant growth and am not losing any money would i be able to still borrow to invest?

    Brials

    To be Honest- your aiming a bit to high…and trust me you would mostly get stuck at property 4-6 because of serviceability and exposure etc…
    When ppl say it’s +VE – at 8% yield…that is JUST enough to cover for the mortgage repayment…and not taking in account any vacancy periods.

    Slow and steady Wins the race :)
    Also having 20+ properties doesn’t make it any “better” then someone who only has 3-4 quality properties.

    Regards
    Michael

    Mick C | Shape Home Loans
    http://www.shapehomeloans.com.au/
    Email Me | Phone Me

    Same Banks. Better Rates. Served With a Passion.

    Profile photo of Scott No MatesScott No Mates
    Participant
    @scott-no-mates
    Join Date: 2005
    Post Count: 3,856

    Silly question: if your income is so good & low expenses, why only $10k savings?

    Consider starting a smsf & put $25k each before end of june as well as your existing super. Watch that you don’t exceed your cap between employer & own salary sacrifice contributions. Not only will income in the smsf be taxed @ 15% compared to your current rate capital gains are lower as well. Get your super working for you. A couple of cf +ve properties will help.

    Profile photo of Mick CMick C
    Participant
    @shape
    Join Date: 2010
    Post Count: 1,099
    Scott No Mates wrote:
    Silly question: if your income is so good & low expenses, why only $10k savings?

    Consider starting a smsf & put $25k each before end of june as well as your existing super. Watch that you don’t exceed your cap between employer & own salary sacrifice contributions. Not only will income in the smsf be taxed @ 15% compared to your current rate capital gains are lower as well. Get your super working for you. A couple of cf +ve properties will help.

    Hi,

    I wouldn’t;t even consider the SMSF;
    1. Age-under 40
    2. SMSF roughly cost $1500-$4000 a year to run…so any “yield” you make would just be eaten up with such a small amount VS a standard super fund control by a organisation which charges only $10-20 per month?

    Yes, me too why such a low deposit?

    Regards
    Michael

    Mick C | Shape Home Loans
    http://www.shapehomeloans.com.au/
    Email Me | Phone Me

    Same Banks. Better Rates. Served With a Passion.

    Profile photo of Scott No MatesScott No Mates
    Participant
    @scott-no-mates
    Join Date: 2005
    Post Count: 3,856

    Whilst you’ve got the income, you should still consider salary sacrifice as this is taxed at only 15% not your marginal rate.

    Why lose an additional 30%+?

    Profile photo of Mick CMick C
    Participant
    @shape
    Join Date: 2010
    Post Count: 1,099
    Scott No Mates wrote:
    Whilst you’ve got the income, you should still consider salary sacrifice as this is taxed at only 15% not your marginal rate.

    Why lose an additional 30%+?

    I dont know ONE single “property investor/ stock investor” that pays the “normal” rate- i personally have ever only pay tax rate below 28-35%…and im not just talking about -ve gearing…

    There are plenty of any way to lower your tax, super may work for someone whos 45-50 who can access this fund in 10 years time…but not when your 23….find a better accountant :)

    1. Salary sacrifice
    2. PAYG adjustment
    3. Insurance Bonds
    4. Depreciation
    5. -ve
    6. Interest in advance
    7. Trust
    8. Shares Rolling lost
    9. Health insurance- Medicare

    Just to name a few from the top of my head…May not work for everyone; but sure doesn’t hurt to ask your accountant.

    Regards
    Michael

    Mick C | Shape Home Loans
    http://www.shapehomeloans.com.au/
    Email Me | Phone Me

    Same Banks. Better Rates. Served With a Passion.

    Profile photo of swampy30swampy30
    Member
    @swampy30
    Join Date: 2003
    Post Count: 85
    Shape wrote:
    Scott No Mates wrote:
    Whilst you've got the income, you should still consider salary sacrifice as this is taxed at only 15% not your marginal rate. Why lose an additional 30%+?

    I dont know ONE single "property investor/ stock investor" that pays the "normal" rate- i personally have ever only pay tax rate below 28-35%…and im not just talking about -ve gearing… There are plenty of any way to lower your tax, super may work for someone whos 45-50 who can access this fund in 10 years time…but not when your 23….find a better accountant :) 1. Salary sacrifice 2. PAYG adjustment 3. Insurance Bonds 4. Depreciation 5. -ve 6. Interest in advance 7. Trust 8. Shares Rolling lost 9. Health insurance- Medicare Just to name a few from the top of my head…May not work for everyone; but sure doesn't hurt to ask your accountant. Regards Michael

    Michael,

    On the basis that the only stupid question, is the unasked one, then "What are insurance bonds"???

    Cheers

    Swampy30

    Profile photo of Mick CMick C
    Participant
    @shape
    Join Date: 2010
    Post Count: 1,099

    Hi,

    No question is to stupid :)

    Im no expert in Insurance bonds- so hopefully a financial planner can share a bit more light…however when i went to speak to a FP for my dad, this is how they explained it..

    You invest say $50,000 into a insurance bond either from your super or salary sacrifice ( could be wrong here…since my dad did it via his super)

    —First 9 years—-

    It pays you franked yield of 6-7% per year –tax at 30% company rate + you get franking credits
    After the 9th years you can sell this insurance bond back to the market and any capital gains ( as it does go up in value over time) will not be tax — ie CGT free- why??? becsaue you have enough franking credit built up for the last 9 years which is enough to offset any CGT.

    Regards
    Michael

    Mick C | Shape Home Loans
    http://www.shapehomeloans.com.au/
    Email Me | Phone Me

    Same Banks. Better Rates. Served With a Passion.

    Profile photo of Benni BrialsBenni Brials
    Participant
    @benni-brials
    Join Date: 2011
    Post Count: 5

    Ok,

    So I will start with the first of the questions and work down.

    1) If you need info let me know what you need, would be happy to supply it.

    2)The reason I have such a low deposit is because my parents left town when I was 19-20 and I was living in a town that had HUGE rent, 1000+ a week with an income of less that 800 pw and to be able to stay in town to put myself in the position I am in now, 120k+ salary I had to get into some debt just to pay the food bill. I have never had a loan or credit card and never wanted on, hence it only took me a year to get out of debt after my apprenticeship and now I can start to look at investing.

    3)  Thanks for all the help guys this is amazing to help me work out my investment strategy.

    4) Shape, Ive got till 2018 till the partner wants to move back, what would you do?

    Benni Brials

    Profile photo of Andrew Lee LawyersAndrew Lee Lawyers
    Participant
    @andrew-lee-lawyers
    Join Date: 2011
    Post Count: 37

    Mike: Know a good accountant near Livo/ Parra?. that deals with inv props, and can do bookeeping?
    Benni, That is one huge coin u got.

    Profile photo of JpcashflowJpcashflow
    Participant
    @jpcashflow
    Join Date: 2007
    Post Count: 575

    Hi Benni,

    Mate where all here to help over the years these guys have all provided with so much information and i wouldn't be where i am without people from here.
    So its good that your being humble and asking for advice. Mate im only 27 one lesson i have learn over the years is this.
    Do you believe that your Motor Bike, Cars and etc are assets .To me these items are expenses because they don't make you money but in fact they cost you money. I would start by looking at how can i cut my expenses?

    Jpcashflow | JP Financial Group
    http://www.jpfinancialgroup.com.au
    Email Me | Phone Me

    Your first port of call in finance :)

    Profile photo of Mick CMick C
    Participant
    @shape
    Join Date: 2010
    Post Count: 1,099
    Andysydney wrote:
    Mike: Know a good accountant near Livo/ Parra?. that deals with inv props, and can do bookeeping?
    Benni, That is one huge coin u got.

    Hi,

    I use chan and naylor – i find them very knowledgeable.

    Regards
    Michael

    Mick C | Shape Home Loans
    http://www.shapehomeloans.com.au/
    Email Me | Phone Me

    Same Banks. Better Rates. Served With a Passion.

Viewing 19 posts - 1 through 19 (of 19 total)

You must be logged in to reply to this topic. If you don't have an account, you can register here.