All Topics / Finance / Have we made a mess of our loan structure?

Viewing 9 posts - 1 through 9 (of 9 total)
  • Profile photo of investor-spongeinvestor-sponge
    Member
    @investor-sponge
    Join Date: 2008
    Post Count: 12

    Hi Fellow investors,
    I would love to hear your advice regarding our current situation and where we should go from here.We currently own:
    1 PPOR worth about 330K (owing 245K to the banks)
    1 IP worth about 320K (owing 295K to the banks)
    My partner and I collectively make about 110K a year. 

    Now the IP loan has an offset account attached to it which we currently put our saving in order to reduce the interest. Whilst our current PPOR loan is currently fixed and so we just make the necessary monthly repayments from the savings we have in the offset of the IP loan (since we cannot use the Offset account attached to PPOR until the fixed term is over).

    In the next few years however we want to look into moving out of the PPOR and turning it into the 2nd IP and purchasing a new PPOR. The new PPOR however would need to be funded from the equity and savings in the offset. Have we dug a hole for ourselves? I understand that turning our current PPOR into an IP would become an issue but is there a way we can restructure our loans so that we can solve this?

    Thanks,

    Profile photo of Richard TaylorRichard Taylor
    Participant
    @qlds007
    Join Date: 2003
    Post Count: 12,024

    Hi IS

    I imagine the fixed rate loan is principal & interest loan and probably cannot be varied whilst under the fixed rate.

    All i would do is when the fixed rate expires switch the entire loan to an interest only loan and link an offset account to the variable portion (You might fix half the loan and keep half variable or a percentage). Reduce the non deductible interest on the loan whilst you are living there and build up your savings in the offset account.

    Richard Taylor | Australia's leading private lender

    Profile photo of danielleedaniellee
    Member
    @daniellee
    Join Date: 2006
    Post Count: 197

    Hi, Investor Sponge

    The wife and I have the very same idea as well, as we have just purchased our first IP, and plan to buy our next PPOR in a few yrs time and covert current PPOR to 2nd IP.

    What I would do is continue to keep my spare money in the IP's offset account. Not ideal as it reduces tax-deductible debt, but better than putting money into a savings account; at least have easy access to the cash. Some lenders allow a limited amount of extra repayments when on a fixed loan, so if I can put any money into your PPOR fixed loan, I would do that.

    Once PPOR fixed loan expires and it goes back into variable PI loan, I would take all money out of the offset and put into the PPOR loan to reduce non-tax deductible debt, assuming a transactional loan account that allows for easy redraw of extra repayments. Continue to work on reducing PPOR loan while not changing anything else.

    When converting current PPOR into 2nd IP, I will then refinance the PPOR loan with current or new lender, follow Richard's suggestion and take out IO loan with offset account, hopefully ay 80% LVR ro avoid LMI. Move into new PPOR and start all over. Revalue IPs every 2-3 yrs to 80% LVR, take out extra equity and leave in offset account for future IP use. No interest paid while money stays in offset account. Only cost are the revaluation fee and slightly increased repayments.

    Regards
    Daniel

    Profile photo of Richard TaylorRichard Taylor
    Participant
    @qlds007
    Join Date: 2003
    Post Count: 12,024

    Sorry Daniel i certainly would not do this Some lenders allow a limited amount of extra repayments when on a fixed loan, so if I can put any money into your PPOR fixed loan, This will contaminate the loan if you redraw on the funds and the purpose is not for investment it will not be tax deductible.

    Richard Taylor | Australia's leading private lender

    Profile photo of TerrywTerryw
    Participant
    @terryw
    Join Date: 2001
    Post Count: 16,213

    It is not an ideal set up, but you are stuck with the fixed.

    I would suggest you change all loans to IO, if not already, – will have to wait for the fixed period to expire. Then set up the offset on the one you are living in. If there is enough equity at this stage, then set up a LOC as well and use this for investment expenses.

    When you decide to buy the new one, reassess.

    I also would not suggest paying down any loans as you will want all spare cash for the new one.

    Terryw | Structuring Lawyers Pty Ltd / Loan Structuring Pty Ltd
    http://www.Structuring.com.au
    Email Me

    Lawyer, Mortgage Broker and Tax Advisor (Sydney based but advising Aust wide) http://www.Structuring.com.au

    Profile photo of hydramaxhydramax
    Participant
    @hydramax
    Join Date: 2009
    Post Count: 47

    Terry would investor sponge need the LOC if he had the 3 IO loans and an offset with the PPOR?

    Would he and his wife be better to pour their salaries and all their rental incomes into the offset?

    Would that maximise their deductions on non ded. debt and at the same time maximise the deductible benefit of the IO loans?

    I value your input, and I may be wrong, would that be reasonable advice.

    Hydramax

    Profile photo of TerrywTerryw
    Participant
    @terryw
    Join Date: 2001
    Post Count: 16,213

    Hyrdramax

    The offsets are excellent products, but you can take it one step further by borrowing for actual investment/business expenses (from the LOC). This will leave the cash you would have used in your offset account saving non-deductible interest while increasing the deductible interest. Overall the interest amount should be the same, you are just increasing the deductible portion. So the LOC could be used to speed up profitability.

    All salaries and rents and other incomes should be placed into the offset. You can also add one of those interest free credit cards with reward points so that your money stays in the offset longer when you use the card for expenses. You also get points which you could use for gift vouchers etc. This all adds up when you are paying rates, insurance etc for many properties.

    The only disadvantage with the above is that you will gradually build up large sums of cash in the offset account and some people can be tempted to spend it when they otherwise wouldn't. You need to be disciplined.

    Terryw | Structuring Lawyers Pty Ltd / Loan Structuring Pty Ltd
    http://www.Structuring.com.au
    Email Me

    Lawyer, Mortgage Broker and Tax Advisor (Sydney based but advising Aust wide) http://www.Structuring.com.au

    Profile photo of hydramaxhydramax
    Participant
    @hydramax
    Join Date: 2009
    Post Count: 47

    Thanks,Terryw, very positive.

    Hydramax

    Profile photo of investor-spongeinvestor-sponge
    Member
    @investor-sponge
    Join Date: 2008
    Post Count: 12

    Wow thanks so much to all for the help, this is why I really value this forum.

    Looks like our hands are tied for the time being until the fixed term of our PPOR is finished.

    Again thanks for all the responses.

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