All Topics / Legal & Accounting / Four investors, one name on title

Viewing 14 posts - 1 through 14 (of 14 total)
  • Profile photo of animamundianimamundi
    Participant
    @animamundi
    Join Date: 2008
    Post Count: 16

    I have recently purchased a property which will be my PPR and my name is solely on the title and mortgage.

    My partner, my sister and her partner will be co-habiting the property.

    Our goal is to create an agreement through which each investor contributes 25% of the mortgage repayments in exchange for a 25% interest in the property.

    We would like to identify the best way to protect the interests of all investors individually and collectively.

    Some of the specific questsions and scenarios we are trying to guard against are:

    * Should we form a Trust and transfer title of the property from my name to the trust?  If this is possible and desirable what kind of trust would be best?  Is there an alternative arrangement that we should consider?
    * In the event that the house is sold and my name remains solely on the title and mortgage how can the profits (assuming there are profits) be distributed equally amongst investors as efficiently for tax purposes as possible?
    * How can we protect the interests of the three investors that are not currently on the title in the event that I die?

    Any other suggestions, advice or insight into issues requiring further consideration would be greatly appreciated.

    Profile photo of TerrywTerryw
    Participant
    @terryw
    Join Date: 2001
    Post Count: 16,213

    This will be complex. You need to speak to a lawyer and probably get an agreement drawn up.

    You could transfer to a trust, but you would be up for stamp duty again. Doing a co-owenership agreement may be easier abd you can work out an arrangement on who pays what and who gets what on the sale. Can also cover death – but as you are sole owner your property will pass to your estate on death and then distributed as per your will.

    Some potential issues/problems
    – what if you go bankrupt? How do you protect the shares of the other parties?
    – Tax. How can the other parties claim any negative gearing etc – if applicable
    – Equity – what happens in the future if one not on title wants to get access to some equity (can cover this in the agreement)
    – Disputes.
    – Exiting. What if one person wants out? How is this acheived and how much do they get, do the others have to buy there share etc?
    – Risk. If things go back it is the title holder that gets hit.

    Terryw | Structuring Lawyers Pty Ltd / Loan Structuring Pty Ltd
    http://www.Structuring.com.au
    Email Me

    Lawyer, Mortgage Broker and Tax Advisor (Sydney based but advising Aust wide) http://www.Structuring.com.au

    Profile photo of animamundianimamundi
    Participant
    @animamundi
    Join Date: 2008
    Post Count: 16

    Thanks for your response Terry, you have raised some valid points which we had not considered – in particular how can the interests of the other investors be protected in the event of my bankruptcy.

    We have already given consideration to the points on Equity and Exit that you raised and feel satisfied with the framework that we have agreed though we're not sure how to make our draft agreement legally valid and enforceable.

    Do you know if it possible to bequeath the property to each of the three other investors as part of my will?

    Thanks again.

    Profile photo of Richard TaylorRichard Taylor
    Participant
    @qlds007
    Join Date: 2003
    Post Count: 12,024

    As Terry has mentioned the matter is fairly complex and you should see Professional legal and Financial advice.

    If you have recently purchased the property as your PPOR you probably qualified for a stamp duty concession and the FHOG.
    Selling the property into Trust or similar may mean that these have to be repaid if you have not lived in the property for the required period of time.

    Another question is WHY would you want to do this.

    Would you not be better off to start again with a new investment property purchased in either all 4 names or with 4 Unit holders.

    Richard Taylor | Australia's leading private lender

    Profile photo of Scott No MatesScott No Mates
    Participant
    @scott-no-mates
    Join Date: 2005
    Post Count: 3,856

    You can bequeath anything that you own to someone in your will, in the case of property you can decide if you want to pass it on to all three as joint tenants (in the same or differing proportions) with the right of survivorship or as tenants in common with nominated proportional ownership and the right of the beneficiaries to independently deal with each portion as they feel necessary.

    Profile photo of animamundianimamundi
    Participant
    @animamundi
    Join Date: 2008
    Post Count: 16

    Thanks Richard.

    We are not wedded to the idea of forming a Trust if this is not feasible or an effective way of protecting the interests of all co-investors – but it is an option that we'd like to investigate further.

    At the time the property was purchased it was not our intention to co-habit.  Since that time co-habitation has become a highly desirable arrangement for everyone.  We have reasoned that if we are to co-habit for an extended period of time then we would aso like to co-invest and collectively enjoy the benefits of living in our own property rather than have one couple continuing to pay rent.

    It is our intention that in time we will purchase a new property together for investment purposes in either all 4 names or as 4 unit holders.

    Profile photo of TerrywTerryw
    Participant
    @terryw
    Join Date: 2001
    Post Count: 16,213

    If you are the only person on the title, then you are the sole legal owner. The others may have a case that you are acting as trustee for their share. This can still be the case if there is no written agreement, but you will have to check with a lawyer on this.

    If you are the sole owner, then you can leave your property to whoever you chose. But you may have this covered in the co-ownership agreement whereby you make a contractual will and agree to leave their share of the property to them or their family etc.

    If it is a trust arrangement, then it is complex as the beneficial ownership of the property can remain the same and the trustee is just swapped if you die.

    Terryw | Structuring Lawyers Pty Ltd / Loan Structuring Pty Ltd
    http://www.Structuring.com.au
    Email Me

    Lawyer, Mortgage Broker and Tax Advisor (Sydney based but advising Aust wide) http://www.Structuring.com.au

    Profile photo of TerrywTerryw
    Participant
    @terryw
    Join Date: 2001
    Post Count: 16,213

    I should also point out that jointly owning property can have adverse consequences on borrowing capacity for future properties. Since  each person is responsible for the whole loan, lenders will assume each person is paying the whole mortgage. But each person is only entitled for 1/4 of the rental income.

    Terryw | Structuring Lawyers Pty Ltd / Loan Structuring Pty Ltd
    http://www.Structuring.com.au
    Email Me

    Lawyer, Mortgage Broker and Tax Advisor (Sydney based but advising Aust wide) http://www.Structuring.com.au

    Profile photo of animamundianimamundi
    Participant
    @animamundi
    Join Date: 2008
    Post Count: 16

    Thanks for the further insight Terry.  Two more questions:

    * What do you mean by the beneficial ownership of the property?
    * Is the adverse consequences on future borrowing capacity in the case of co-ownership avoided by forming and purchasing through a Trust?

    As you may have guessed, I am very green on the ins and outs of Trusts!

    Cheers
    B

    Profile photo of TerrywTerryw
    Participant
    @terryw
    Join Date: 2001
    Post Count: 16,213

    Hi B

    Beneficial ownership is when someone else owns something for you. They are the legal owner, but you are the real owner.

    Adverse future borrowing consequences can be avoided if you plan ahead and try to keep one person in control. You need to limit people the number of people borrowing/guaranteeing the loan. say you needed an income of $80,000pa to service the loan, you would be 'wasting' people by including 4 people earning $80,000 each. I would use one person this time, and then the other 3 will have clean borrowing records and they have borrow in the future more easy. You could increase the total borrowing capacity by 4.

    So what you need to do is limit this somehow while giving the others the benefits as well. A trust can work in this area, though you have to be careful with the wording of the trust with some banks – if others are mentioned on the trust then some banks want a guarantee from them too. You would have the trustee as one person, or as a company with one director, and that way only 1 has to guarantee the loan – usually. When that person maxes out on borrowings, a new trust can be formed with the next person as trustee, and so on. Each person can still benefit from the profits/incomes as a beneficiary.

    You could also just buy in one name and then have an agreement to share things

    Terryw | Structuring Lawyers Pty Ltd / Loan Structuring Pty Ltd
    http://www.Structuring.com.au
    Email Me

    Lawyer, Mortgage Broker and Tax Advisor (Sydney based but advising Aust wide) http://www.Structuring.com.au

    Profile photo of animamundianimamundi
    Participant
    @animamundi
    Join Date: 2008
    Post Count: 16

    Terry, thank you again for your consideration and reply.

    The final option that you mentioned (buying in one name and having an agreement to share things) is the one which we will adopt for this property from the outset.  It's fair to say though that I have some doubts about the legal enforceability of the obligations and responsibilities that we include in an agreement formed between the four of us that is made without a full (or even reasonable!) appreciation of the law of property within Australia.

    I know that there's no substitute for professional legal advice but I have a sense that it will not come cheap and so I would like to be as well informed as possible ahead of seeking such advice!

    Thanks again.
    B

    Profile photo of TerrywTerryw
    Participant
    @terryw
    Join Date: 2001
    Post Count: 16,213

    Hi B

    Yes, it is best to learn as much as you can before seeking advice – its all good knowledge and will save you money.

    For this one, since you have already purchased, I think you should just try to protect everyone as much as possible and then plan for the future ones by looking into using trusts etc.

    Terryw | Structuring Lawyers Pty Ltd / Loan Structuring Pty Ltd
    http://www.Structuring.com.au
    Email Me

    Lawyer, Mortgage Broker and Tax Advisor (Sydney based but advising Aust wide) http://www.Structuring.com.au

    Profile photo of animamundianimamundi
    Participant
    @animamundi
    Join Date: 2008
    Post Count: 16

    In the event that the property is sold at a profit what is the best way to distribute to co-investors their share of the profits?

    Are there are any blindingly obvious pitfalls or considerations that we should be aware of?

    Cheers
    B

    Profile photo of TerrywTerryw
    Participant
    @terryw
    Join Date: 2001
    Post Count: 16,213

    B

    I think you should probably work out the profit after taknig into account all holding expenses, buying and selling costs, any land tax, CGT tax etc, and then share it as per your ownership percentages.

    Terryw | Structuring Lawyers Pty Ltd / Loan Structuring Pty Ltd
    http://www.Structuring.com.au
    Email Me

    Lawyer, Mortgage Broker and Tax Advisor (Sydney based but advising Aust wide) http://www.Structuring.com.au

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