GO BEAR GO!!!!!!!!
[exhappy][exhappy]
Here we go, here we go again!…lol
Kind regards
Chan Dollars
[Retire Young, Retire Rich] [strum]“There was no reason for us to become involved _ That was a war based on lies and misinterpretations from London and from Washington, claiming falsely that Saddam Hussein was responsible for the 9/11 attacks,” he told the Independent newspaper.
from the above news…
I think for killing 10000 people in Iraq George bush should be cuba jail along with oSAMA and Saddam
Cheers
[
]
PropertyGuRu
[sultan]Should we discussing property investing here? oh this is opinionated forum, sorry!
Kind regards
Chan Dollars
[Retire Young, Retire Rich] [strum]Pisces,
I’ve been away for 4 days so apologies for coming in late here… but in a reply to scott, were you linking 9/11 to Saddam? If so, how/why? I know the US administration has made the link in the past, then recanted, then made it again…
If I’ve misread your post, please disregard.
Also, what has Bush achieved in the past 12 months? Does leading the mightiest army on earth to victory over a rag tag opposition really count as a huge achievement? Did Iraq really pose such a huge threat to the US and other allies? Why did the war turn from being all about WMD’s in the beginning, to the deliverance of “freedom” in the end, once absolutely no evidence of WMD’s was found? There’s really too much to go into here isn’t there? But if you could address my initial question, that would be great.
r
Hi all
Great discussion just have to put in my 2 cents worth.
Well i think that everybody should be against terrorism.
Bush took his eye of terrorism and blamed iraq and suddam for everything he could manufacture and sell to the world as in WMD.
Howard pretty much dances to Bushes tune.
Interestingly in parliament Howard said that pulling our boys out as indicated by Latham would have serious consequences? He didnt say for who? did he mean Australia.
At the end of the day is the world a better place without Suddam it doesn’t appear to be. Terrorism is getting worse. This is a sore that is going to fester for a fair while and could trigger WW3.
Why doesnt America get involved in other countries if they want to be consistent other countries have nuclear capabilites etc.
This was about Daddy and the oil.
regards
alfOriginally posted by alf:Hi all
Great discussion just have to put in my 2 cents worth.
Well i think that everybody should be against terrorism.
Bush took his eye of terrorism and blamed iraq and suddam for everything he could manufacture and sell to the world as in WMD.
Howard pretty much dances to Bushes tune.
Interestingly in parliament Howard said that pulling our boys out as indicated by Latham would have serious consequences? He didnt say for who? did he mean Australia.
At the end of the day is the world a better place without Suddam it doesn’t appear to be. Terrorism is getting worse. This is a sore that is going to fester for a fair while and could trigger WW3.
Why doesnt America get involved in other countries if they want to be consistent other countries have nuclear capabilites etc.
This was about Daddy and the oil.
regards
alfBingo
Regards BearPOSITVE CASHFLOW properties and Joint Ventures available!
For the BEST deals register via E-mail [email protected]
DONT MISS OUT!!!!!>>Also, what has Bush achieved in the past 12 months? <<
If one takes a few steps back then there are a whole lot of things which are very clear as having been achieved.
Has Bush solved the terrorist problem ?
No of course not. Not yet anyway.
Yet, the achievements are quite big.
Firstly, he has chased away the Taliban who were protecting and supporting the Osama Bin laden mob.
Secondly, eventually there will be a democratic
government in Afghanistan, a moderate one like Turkey perhaps ?Thirdly, the changing of mind of Pakistan’s leader Musharef is of enormous help as terrorists hiding in the mountains would have been very hard to catch (if at all possible).
Fourthly, Musharef’ turning towards the West means a big step towards peace between India and Pakistan.
Fifthly, changing the government of Iraq to a democratic (and, again, hopefully a moderate government) also will go a long way towards
helping to create a more peaceful Middle East.Sixthly, the invasion of Iraq has helped change Libya’s Gadaffi’s mind.
He suddenly has seen the light and, again, he will likely discontinue to support terrorists and stir up trouble in the Middle East).
Seventhly, by rattling the sabres Iran (as is the case with Syria as well) too has been shaken up and is likely to (eventually) moderate their outlook the moment the USA has some sparetime to address that issue.
Now if all of the above doesn’t amount to a big achievement then my handle isn’t Pisces. [biggrin]
I just cannot understand that there are people who stubbornly continue to maintain that Bush hasn’t achieved anything.
The oil argument is completely useless in explaining Bush’s actions 100%.
Of course it is one of the reasons but there are many other factors which helped shape the action.
Pisces
“Firstly, he has chased away the Taliban who were protecting and supporting the Osama Bin laden mob”.
So that would explain why they have managed to capture Bun Laden and why the Taliban still control portions of Afghanisatn
Secondly, eventually there will be a democratic
government in Afghanistan, a moderate one like Turkey perhaps ?So the various warlords that control the areas outside Kabul are going to take notice of a leader appointed by the US. Did you also know that acording to the Red Cross it is estmated that Turkey has killed more Kurds that Iraq…there’s an incovenient fact
Thirdly, the changing of mind of Pakistan’s leader Musharef is of enormous help as terrorists hiding in the mountains would have been very hard to catch (if at all possible).
See earlier point about catching Bin Laden. PS had you noticed that Musharef is actually a dictator who doesnt allow freedom of press and whose human rights record is appalling particularly when it comes to the treatment of women
Fourthly, Musharef’ turning towards the West means a big step towards peace between India and Pakistan.
That would explain why Musharef constantly has someone watching his back because of the influence of radical Islam within Pakistan. It would also explain why India and Pakistan exchange fire on a regular basis
Fifthly, changing the government of Iraq to a democratic (and, again, hopefully a moderate government) also will go a long way towards
helping to create a more peaceful Middle East.Thats why the largest religous block in Iraq refuses to acknowledge the legitimacy of the new constitution. Yep it should work well when more than half the country wont accept its authority
Sixthly, the invasion of Iraq has helped change Libya’s Gadaffi’s mind.
Gaddafi’s decision has more to do with economics rather than politics
Seventhly, by rattling the sabres Iran (as is the case with Syria as well) too has been shaken up and is likely to (eventually) moderate their outlook the moment the USA has some sparetime to address that issue.
So thats why Iran elected a hardline conservative government and swung away from the west. And have ramped up their nuclear weapons program
If the US were serious about bringing stability to the middle east they would try and find a way out of the bloody morass that the Israeli’s and Palestinians have created for themselves.
There are according to the US State Department about 43 dictators stretching in an arc from China through North Korea, Central Asia, Pakistan and into Africa. If the US were seious about dealing with these appalling individuals they would remove all of them. But there is a problem, the two biggest China and North Korea have no oil and are more than capable of looking after themselves.
Yeh, Valiantwagon, I can really see that you have all the answers to the problems of the world.
[laughing]Thank heavens for people like you with such insight.
Pisces
I actually think valiantwagon’s responses aren’t too far off the mark… in 10 years time will Musharraf be friend or foe? Saddam was a friend for a while then fell out of favour… Afghanistan is a basket case and the Taliban have not been chased away… where is Osama? He’s done a pretty good job of evading the most powerful army on the face of the earth hasn’t he?
Also, I thought the second in charge of Al Qaeda was supposed to be cornered in the mountains on the Afghan-Pakistani border and was on the cusp of being captured… what happened?? He disappeared.
The US support dictators who toe the line (read: cater to American interests), and are hostile to those that don’t… even Noriega was best buddies with them until he fell out of favour… As for labelling Iraq a success, do you actually read much press about what’s going on there? It’s another basket case…
I agree the Yanks could do more in the Israeli/Palestinian issue, but exactly what that is, I’m not sure…
For what it’s worth I think Gadaffi’s decision is based on a mixture of economics and politics… not a black and white decision at all…
Just as a point of interest, who’s going to be the next bad guy once Osama’s gone? Saddam replaced the Russians, and Osama’s public enemy number one, but once he’s caught, where will the focus turn if at all on an individual? Perhaps it’ll just be the faceless members of Al Qaeda, but I’m tipping North Korea’s Kim… because it seems there always has to be a bad guy… I wonder whether the “line” will ever come out that North Korea is a supporter of Al Qaeda?
Cheers
r>>For what it’s worth I think Gadaffi’s decision is based on a mixture of economics and politics… not a black and white decision at all…<<
Who cares what Gaddafi’s motivation is for turning towards the West. The point is that there is now one less source of troublesomely stoking up the fire in the Middle East.
Just as Saddam not being around any more means the very same kind of thing.
My
predictionsprojections ?A revolution in Iran overturning the mullahs.
(without physical involvement by the USA) OR a softening up of the oppression by the Mullah regime in which case the public is likely to just continue to put up with things.North Korea ? It too will collapse because of economic reasons just like the former Russian (i.e. communistic) empire did.
Pisces
>>Afghanistan is a basket case and the Taliban have not been chased away… where is Osama? <<
I guess he is hiding out in a cave, living an ascetic and nomadic life, full of excitement, running away from the Pakistani army.
The real question is whether he will be caught or die from pneunomia or cave-rot first ?
Pisces
or will OBL be magically captured a couple of weeks before the Americans go to the polls? I know that’s cynical, but I wouldn’t be surprised…
Cheers
rWhilst that would be a nice gesture by Musharraf
it sounds too much like a plot exposed by the conspiracy theory people.Then again, perhaps you should suggest to your boss to have a camera team handy, just in case.
Pisces
I reckon Musharraf will do whatever he’s told to do.
Also I’m sure George Dubya would have the PR (or perhaps, propaganda) team in place to get some shots then release carefully chosen shots on a video news release… I’m not a huge conspiracy theorist, and I’m not saying it’s going to happen, but I just wouldn’t be surprised if George pulls it out of the hat as his popularity dwindles… it’s politics after all.
cheers
r
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