All Topics / General Property / Property trusts

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  • Profile photo of waz11waz11
    Member
    @waz11
    Join Date: 2004
    Post Count: 35

    hi,

    I am trying to find out as much information as possible on commercial property trusts..
    I have no idea where to find information on this so I was hoping for a link or something that might be able to help me out.

    thanks,

    Waz11

    Profile photo of Steve McKnightSteve McKnight
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    @stevemcknight
    Join Date: 2001
    Post Count: 1,763

    Hi Waz11,

    Thanks for your post.

    I’m a little confused as to what you want more information on…

    Is it:

    1. A general property trust that is run commercially (i.e. accepts investments from the general public); or

    2. A property trust that specifically invests in commercial property.

    Operating through a turst is nothing unusual by itself. If you are looking for a type 1 version then it may be you just need to look for property trusts that are listed on the ASX (e.g. see: S&P/ASX 200 Property Trusts).

    These entities pool public money to acquire property according to their prospectus – often shopping centres and the like.

    They are listed on the ASX, meaning that units are bought and sold via a broker.

    Here’s a quick link to help you understand more.

    If it is item 2 then any trust can potentially invest in commercial property (subject to the terms of the trust deed). It may be either public or private.

    Hope this helps.

    Bye,

    Steve McKnight

    **********
    Remember that success comes from doing things differently.
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    Steve McKnight | PropertyInvesting.com Pty Ltd | CEO
    https://www.propertyinvesting.com

    Success comes from doing things differently

    Profile photo of Steve McKnightSteve McKnight
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    @stevemcknight
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    Hi,

    Following on from my initial post, I have decided to come back and write a more comprehensive answer.

    Property Trusts

    The first point to note here is the accounting structure mentioned, i.e. a trust.

    A trust is a legal structure that exists where ownership is separate from entitlement. For example, in a trust the assets are administered by the trustee for the benefit (i.e. earning of income) that flows through to those entitled to receive those profits (i.e. the beneficiaries).

    The type of trust mentioned here is a unit trust, which means that beneficaries’ entitlements is based on the number of units held (i.e. the more units, the more profits flow through to them).

    The value of these units is reflected in two ways:

    1. The underlying value of the asset base – meaning that as assets appreciate in value then so too does the value of the units; and

    2. Speculation – usually in respect to future values or earnings.

    Transacting of Units

    Property trusts can be public or private in nature. Units in Public Property Trusts are traded on the Australian Stock Exchange, and as such you’ll need a broker (or an e-trade account) to instigate a buy or sell order.

    On the other hand, purchase and sale of units in Private Property Trusts are transacted out of the public’s eye.

    You could say there are two types of private trusts:

    * Private public property trusts – whose units are available for the general public to purchase, and where the amount of funds or number of investors are large enough to warrant that a prospectus (meeting ASIC guidelines) be issued, however these units are not traded on the stock exchange; and

    * Truly private property trusts that don’t meet the ASIC requirements requiring a prospectus, and instead are privately administered.

    Authority

    The authority (i.e. the document outlining the rules) for any property trust are contained in the trust deed. This would include the purchase and sale of the units, trustee powers etc.

    Where the trust is listed on the ASX then it must also meet further requirements under the ASX listing rules.

    Purpose

    The general purpose of having a property trust is for various investors to pool their resources (and thus spread the risk) to acquire property, usually of a significant dollar value (such as a shopping centre, inner city building etc.).

    Well, that’s about it for now… hope this has provided a little more information.

    Cheers,

    Steve McKnight

    **********
    Remember that success comes from doing things differently.
    **********

    Steve McKnight | PropertyInvesting.com Pty Ltd | CEO
    https://www.propertyinvesting.com

    Success comes from doing things differently

    Profile photo of waz11waz11
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    @waz11
    Join Date: 2004
    Post Count: 35

    Hi,

    Thanks Steve. Your answers were exactly what I was after. The type I was interested in seems to be the ones that are listed on the ASX.

    I will follow your link and try to research what I can from what you have given me.

    Really couldnt have asked for more information at this stage so thanks again.

    Cheers,

    Waz11

    Profile photo of Steve McKnightSteve McKnight
    Keymaster
    @stevemcknight
    Join Date: 2001
    Post Count: 1,763

    Hey mate,

    You’re more than welcome! Please report back with your decision / research / more questions.

    Regards,

    Steve McKnight

    **********
    Remember that success comes from doing things differently.
    **********

    Steve McKnight | PropertyInvesting.com Pty Ltd | CEO
    https://www.propertyinvesting.com

    Success comes from doing things differently

    Profile photo of waz11waz11
    Member
    @waz11
    Join Date: 2004
    Post Count: 35

    hi,

    I have a few more quesitons:

    – can you borrow money to put into a commercial trust (ie: will a bank give you a secured loan against the units you have in the trust?)

    – I have read of average returns being anywhere from 8% – 15% per year. Is there anything else that needs to be payed into the trust? IE: any group bills or anything – any other hidden costs?

    – if there are no other costs that are involved then you basically are making a percentage return based on how much you are paying on interest for the loan to buy into the trust ( assuming you can get a loan for this) ie: interest on loan = 7% return = 12% – therefore actually profit = 12%-7% = 5%. does this seem corerct ?

    any help would be appreciated..

    Waz11

    Profile photo of redwingredwing
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    @redwing
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    Dont forget the interest on the loan is deductible [biggrin]

    You would be better off speaking to a broker

    Why not contact http://www.freemanfox.com and speak to one of thier brokers, as Peter’s an advocate of LPT’s

    REDWING

    “Money is a currency, like electricity and it requires momentum to make it Effective”
    Count The Currency With This Online Positive Cashflow Calculator

    Profile photo of waz11waz11
    Member
    @waz11
    Join Date: 2004
    Post Count: 35

    Cheers Redwing…

    LPT’s ?

    Waz11

    Profile photo of Still in SchoolStill in School
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    @still-in-school
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    Originally posted by waz11:

    – can you borrow money to put into a commercial trust (ie: will a bank give you a secured loan against the units you have in the trust?)

    – I have read of average returns being anywhere from 8% – 15% per year. Is there anything else that needs to be payed into the trust? IE: any group bills or anything – any other hidden costs?

    – if there are no other costs that are involved then you basically are making a percentage return based on how much you are paying on interest for the loan to buy into the trust ( assuming you can get a loan for this) ie: interest on loan = 7% return = 12% – therefore actually profit = 12%-7% = 5%. does this seem corerct ?

    any help would be appreciated..

    Waz11

    Hi Waz11,

    you can do a margin lend, when purchasing shares, though it will depend on the margin LVR, that is willing to be lent out.

    i dont really like property trust, as they are slow moving stocks, and to be honest, you can earn more from solid blue chips stocks and have margin lend on them.

    though those returns are true… that is on a very few selected small amount of stocks, that can consistenly grow at 15% for a few years, before the stock hits an acceptable peak… and just sits at that price.

    my real main concern is, if you investing into property and into the share market (but also buying property trust – LPT), your not diversifying your self..

    and to me personally this is a little bit of extra risk you are carrying on…

    Cheers,
    sis

    Wanna Talk About Stocks

    Profile photo of redwingredwing
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    @redwing
    Join Date: 2003
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    LPT

    Listed Property Trusts

    I agree with SiS in the sense that you are still investing in property, however..according to my recollection of what Peter said, he believes that they both move in slightly different cycles in his experience.

    SiS is more of a trader (am i right?) with stocks and taking his profits where he can rather than a buy and hold investor in shares.

    Depends if you have the time and knowledge to devote to the strategy you prefer.

    I suggest following SiS’s link to “wanna talk about stocks” Waz

    REDWING

    “Money is a currency, like electricity and it requires momentum to make it Effective”
    Count The Currency With This Online Positive Cashflow Calculator

    Profile photo of Still in SchoolStill in School
    Member
    @still-in-school
    Join Date: 2003
    Post Count: 1,844

    Hi Redwing,

    lol… thats correct [strum] i’m very passionate about my intrady trading activity…

    Cheers,
    sis

    Wanna Talk About Stocks

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