All Topics / General Property / List of Property Spruikers

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  • Profile photo of Henry AdamsHenry Adams
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    @henry-adams
    Join Date: 2011
    Post Count: 105

    Hi All,

    Does anyone here know or have the list of Property Spruikers in Australia or Sydney in general ?

    Feel free to PM me or post it in here to help others before getting burn in the wrong way.

    Cheers,

    H

    Profile photo of Jamie MooreJamie Moore
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    @jamie-m
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    Post Count: 5,069

    Hi Henry

    Just do a search on any particular companies that you're concerned about – chances are they've been asked about on the forum before.

    Cheers

    Jamie

    Jamie Moore | Pass Go Home Loans Pty Ltd
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    Profile photo of Thread BareThread Bare
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    Direct Property Network or DPN

    First Floor / 48-52 Cronulla Street

    Cronulla NSW 2230

    They claim to have offices in all states, but they don't actually rent them or have any staff there. Check out there office in Cronulla, nightclub toilets?

    https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=504852846228088&set=a.471127339600639.104475.201736579873051&type=1&theater

    https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=471127352933971&set=a.471127339600639.104475.201736579873051&type=1&theater

    Shiny offices, Shiny suits & Shiny shoes, and of course great big shiny smiles. These guys are mudguards charging 7%-9% marketing Comm's. 

    Profile photo of Henry AdamsHenry Adams
    Member
    @henry-adams
    Join Date: 2011
    Post Count: 105

    Ah cool.

    Because when I go to the SCAM watch page, I couldn't find anything http://www.scamwatch.gov.au/content/index.phtml/tag/InvestmentSeminarsRealEstateScams

    Profile photo of Scott No MatesScott No Mates
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    Henry Adams wrote:
    Hi All,

    Does anyone here know or have the list of Property Spruikers in Australia or Sydney in general ?

    Cheers,

    H

    Basically anyone who invites you to a free seminar on PI, +ve CF, buying property in super etc and then having a list of properties to choose from or roping you in to buying some expensive mentoring/education course.

    Profile photo of Jamie MooreJamie Moore
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    @jamie-m
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    Scott No Mates wrote:
    Henry Adams wrote:
    Hi All,

    Does anyone here know or have the list of Property Spruikers in Australia or Sydney in general ?

    Cheers,

    H

    Basically anyone who invites you to a free seminar on PI, +ve CF, buying property in super etc and then having a list of properties to choose from or roping you in to buying some expensive mentoring/education course.

    Scott has summed it up nicely. There's plenty of these companies popping up too – and there's bugger all (if any) regulation of the industry which is quite scary. 

    Cheers

    Jamie

    Jamie Moore | Pass Go Home Loans Pty Ltd
    http://www.passgo.com.au
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    Mortgage Broker assisting clients Australia wide Email: [email protected]

    Profile photo of Henry AdamsHenry Adams
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    @henry-adams
    Join Date: 2011
    Post Count: 105

    Ah I see, because previously I have been conned by JDL strategies and also almost got caught up again with the Custodians Wealth Builder. 

    I guess you are right guys when it comes to the free property then there is high chance that they are the scammers if they are all in one company offering one stop shop investment solution. 

    Profile photo of Colin RiceColin Rice
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    @fms
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    Henry Adams wrote:
    I guess you are right guys when it comes to the free property then there is high chance that they are the scammers if they are all in one company offering one stop shop investment solution. 

    Its true there are sharks out there but don't miss the genuine operators that can help you on your journey. They definitely exist you just have to have the eyes to see and the ears to hear.  

    Colin Rice | CDR Finance
    http://cdrfinance.com.au/
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    Perth Based Mortgage Broker - Investment Property Finance Specialist | E: cr[email protected]

    Profile photo of VENTURENTVENTURENT
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    Join Date: 2013
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    G'day Henry and others; I certainly don't have a list but I can comment on two Queensland companies.  I personally own four investment properties but foolishly invested cash  in a property syndicate to 'spread the eggs'.  Worst idea ever!  To the best of my knowledge, both The Investors Club and Custodian Wealth Builders provide sound investment training (ie principles and strategies).  I have strong reservations about purchasing stock through their medium although acquisition by this means will suit some who can afford the oncosts and want to avoid many of the hassles attendant to personal involvement.  I personally prefer to apply the sound principles espoused in books by Margaret Lomas, John Fitzgerald etc.  However, there is often a difference between what one writes and what one practises.   My greatest concerns lie in the 'Razzmatazz' approach adopted by Custodian Wealthbuilders (John Fitzgerald) who certainly put on a good show but are subject to the usual downsides when one peeks under the skirts.  Avoid at all costs any cash investments into Custodian property syndicates!  While some may make a return in very good times, they are fraught with hidden problems and the bulk of any returns is sucked out by the principals very early regardless of the success of the project.  READ THE PROSPECTUS SMALL PRINT THOROUGHLY AND YOU WILL NEVER SIGN UP!!  Seminars and workshops provide hype and all sorts of verbal/loosely written assurances.  The bottom line: – totally-unsecured capital, indefinite tenure (a registered company until wound up) and absolutely no investor control over the management and execution of the project.  When it all goes bad, the unsecured creditor waits at the end of the line while everybody (and I mean EVERYBODY ELSE) consumes the residue left by CWB. As an example, CWB/ Custodian Land project at Cunningham Rise, Goodna was touted as projecting a 45% return over a 31 month term – reasonable at face value.  The facts: the management was incompetent and hugely overspent with sales slowing while keeping the shareholders in the dark.  Then all capital (other than a 17% initial return) is retained until at least June 2016, at which time investors might expect a further 29% of original capital at current estimates.  Projected result?  Instead of a 3 year safe investment – Projected 54% capital loss after six years and zero dividend. Of course, JLF walk away with millions.  Their Victorian project is not much better.   While the company will claim (correctly) that the buyer should beware; this ignores slick marketing, very loose initial verbal/written assurances and cleverly-hidden, vital information all designed to misrepresent or mislead.  The bottom line is that Custodian and others would never attract investment capita lfor their developments if they promulgated the true contract conditions in clear, everyday language.  John Fitzgerald is marketed as a clean-cut, whiz kid out to save the world and his disciples bolster that image.  Don't be fooled!  These guys are ruthless, rip extravagant fees and commissions out of every project, outsource project servicing to their advantage and are happy to gull keen investors into socking hard-earned superannuation into their self-serving projects.  They are legally secure and happy to retire behind the Corporations Act when called to account.  ASIC probably can't touch them.  That's why they are millionaires.  Stick with property and use their experience and knowledge by all means – but never invest with these sharks. I trusted them …never again!   If you feel that this is sour grapes, ask yourself if you really want to consort with men and women lacking integrity and who are happy to hazard mums' and dads' savings without any safeguards, while furthering their own gross interests from behind the protection of legally-disassociated entities and corporate law. THERE ARE NO PROTECTIONS IN LAW AGAINST THESE TYPE OF OPERATIONS.

    Profile photo of Modernity InvestingModernity Investing
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    @mark-coburn
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    VENTURENT, 

    Welcome and thank you for explaining in excellent detail your experiences. The position of property marketing companies in the investment marketplace is misunderstood by investors. We talk to clients everyday who are shocked at what goes on within the marketing industry, and even more shocked at how little they actually knew. This is after they have spent years researching the purchase of a property, which is why there needs to be a change in the way they are allowed to present what they do.  

    ASIC could start with requiring "WE DON'T WORK FOR YOU, WE ONLY CARE ABOUT OURSELVES" being written across the front of all marketing company communications. 

    Modernity Investing
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    Profile photo of Nigel KibelNigel Kibel
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    @nigel-kibel
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    Not everyone who involved in the industry is a ripe off merchant but a lot are. The secret is always do you own due diligence and do not take anyones word for anything.

    I even tell my mentoring students if I make a suggestion do not take my word for it do your own due diligence because at the end of the day its there money not mine.so spend the time and do your due diligence carefully before committing your money to anyone.

    Nigel Kibel | Property Know How
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    Profile photo of Modernity InvestingModernity Investing
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    @mark-coburn
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    Nigel Kibel wrote:
    Not everyone who involved in the industry is a ripe off merchant but a lot are.

    Which Industry Nigel?

    There a few to select from: Real Estate Agents, Buyer's Agents, Mortgage Brokers, Banks, Valuers, Marketing Companies OR Unqualified Advisors?

    Modernity Investing
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    Profile photo of Nigel KibelNigel Kibel
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    @nigel-kibel
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    Most come from marketing companies who run seminars or education seminars where the sole aim is to sell property. For instance the reason companies sell house and land to investors is because there is at least a $30,000 commission in place.

    Nigel Kibel | Property Know How
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    Profile photo of BoughtWithEquityBoughtWithEquity
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    @boughtwithequity
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    A problem for many investors is simply comparing the various real estate investment groups that are out here.  I think the key to it is seeking a group offering the most security and a model where their real payout is based on their continued performance.  I've personally been involved in various types of real estate investing over the years here in the US.  The model I use today produces very good results and our partners get a secured 10% per deal before we earn anything.  They also take a 50% split on the backend  when the renovated & rented property is sold off to passive investors who get some equity and a 10% net return guaranteed for 18 months.  All funds are held by a licensed GA attorney in escrow and the front-end investor can either go on title as an owner or, with our foreign partners, be secured as a 1st lienholder.  

    The biggest problem I have seen with US operators, and again not all of them, is that at best they are usually just wholesalers offering "rent ready" properties.  Once that sale is made, the seller has no incentive to perform any further and you run the risk of being stuck with a property that will never rent.  I just spoke with someone who bought a couple of properties in Detroit that never rented…great way to lose $100k.  With our model, we only make the greatest return only if the property is sold after it has fully rented.  The model minimizes risk and maximizes returns while forcing us to earn our money by performance.  I like that!  We don't earn any commissions at all on front-end purchases.  Every model is different but I would be looking for something like ours where the seller has some incentive to perform after the initial sale.  Happy Investing!

    Profile photo of Nigel KibelNigel Kibel
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    America is a great place to invest but full of spruikers and well meaning people who do not know what they are doing.

    The secret  to successfully investing anywhere is the location but also who you deal with. Who you deal with will determine whether your invest is great or a nightmare. I believe a lot of people may have lost money however they just don't know it yet.As an example many of the so called sellers are wholesalers and are not even based in the cities they are buying you property in. There are people in Australia who have not met the suppliers they deal with 

    The fact is that there are great deals in America especially as the markets are now recovering. 

    The good news is that a number of people on this site do have great advice such as Jay and engel.

    I have been involved in the US market since 2005 and have a full time business partner on the ground who not only understands the residential market but is also a commercial specialist. So if you are considering investing in Americia look at the following check list

    Are they based in America or do they have a partner in the state or city in which you are buying.?

    Have you established the correct tax structure and tax file number for your LLC?

    Do they personally inspect every property they buy for you?

    Do they supply full property management?

    Nigel Kibel | Property Know How
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    Profile photo of VENTURENTVENTURENT
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    @venturent
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    Re my post about Custodian Land syndicates (spruikers):  While engaged in disputation with the CEO about unauthorised retention of capital beyond the understood investment term, arrogant treatment of investors plus failure to respond to requests for project information; the most provocative statement made by the Custodian representative was "We work for you – we have your best interests at heart" or words to that effect (stated while stonewalling our requests for explanations).  Comforting, isn't it!

    Profile photo of DaOneDaOne
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    Has anyone come across Paul Bieg from Big Property investments. He sells properties in Queensland and Western Australia in mining areas. I am interested in understanding if anyone has come across Paul and if they have invested through him

    DaOne | Oras Finance - Your Local Mortgage Broker
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    Profile photo of Adrian CahillAdrian Cahill
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    I just got ripped by

    realestateinvestar.com.au

    Was on a 7day trial, with a subscription to follow. They charged me for the subscription before the trial was over. Lucky I know how to raise so much bad publicity on their company that my refund should be coming in a few days.

    I've been let down by a couple of subscriptions, and seen my family disapointed by some education companyies. I strongly prefer books and then spending the time to find genuine Mentors, real help and honest advice. There are a lot of awesome people out there helping others. Just have to keep highlighting and exposing the frauds.

    Adrian Cahill | AdrianCahill.com Personal Development Expert
    http://adriancahill.com/from-investor-to-coach/
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    Here since 2002, however things have evolved over the years.

    Profile photo of JohnJohn
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    @mozza65
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    Has anyone dealt with DPN from Cronulla NSW

    Profile photo of Richard TaylorRichard Taylor
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    @qlds007
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    John

    Read one of the opening posts in this thread. https://www.propertyinvesting.com/topic/4410191-list-of-property-spruikers/

    Cheers

    Richard

    Richard Taylor | Australia's leading private lender

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