All Topics / Overseas Deals / DETROIT BANKRUPT

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  • Profile photo of Nigel KibelNigel Kibel
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    For all the people suggesting that Detroit is a good place to invest. The state governor declared the city bankrupt to the tune of $19 billion dollars

    There are 79,000 vacant buildings

    The population has declined by 69%

    Do you due diligence carefully before you spend your money. There are much better places to invest in America such as Texas and Florida. Great opportunities to make money however dont invest in dying cities

    Regards

    Nigel Kibel

    http://www.propertyknowhow.com.au

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    Profile photo of jayhinrichsjayhinrichs
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    Come devils night there will be about 10,000 less vacant buildings…. For those who do not know.. Devils night is the night after Halloween ( and maybe you do not know what Halloween is)  any way… the Natives in Detroit set fire to thousands of vacant homes on Devils night… I did a lot of bizz in Detroit back in the day… And there are great brick homes that were built by European craftsmen however those folks are long gone.  As with all things though if you get out of Wayne county there are some pretty nice spots.. there are still many weathly areas there,, However this is were Nigel and I agree wholeheartily, tread very cautiously when looking at a property that is cheaper than stamp duty in AU. Or the price of a car.. Your just throwing your money down the drain .. the Tenant pool in Detroit is very tough  Not nearly as managable as the same socio demographics as the South east,,, just saying

    Profile photo of Scott No MatesScott No Mates
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    This may cause a few global repercussions wrt finance as well.

    Profile photo of Nigel KibelNigel Kibel
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    http://detroiturbex.com/

    This is a great site but sad

    Many photos and a history of any of the now abondoned buildings

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    Profile photo of KnoxOffKnoxOff
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    Profile photo of Benson_JBenson_J
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    Probably a naive question, but is this an opportunity to, put it simply, 'buy low, sell high'? Granted this would be a long term proposition, but isn't this an opportunity for the city to begin rebuilding, diversify industries etc?

    Are there any case studies of similar circumstances in smaller municipalities around the world that may highlight the long term outcomes?

    Just food (and questions) for thought.

    Profile photo of jayhinrichsjayhinrichs
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    Benson,  if your talking Detroit and Wayne county,  then I think your talking about buying low and selling for even lower whilst getting your properties vandalised etc…. Not that one could not make a go of it in Detroit.. the locals can and do but you cannot do it from your arm chair in AU.  In my humble opinion.  I tried to post  a hyperlink for a few good Detroit articles but for some reason does not work on this site… A lot of good articles floating about right now that will give you the history of Detroit and other Rust best cities and why Detroit has not and probably will never return.. Cannot save never but 99% sure it won't in any of our life times…  There simply is too many existiing homes. The population of Detoit is 83% black and the racial tensions are still alive and well.  Surrounding suburbs were the white flight went may stand a chance.. However I for one still think the Sun belt and West Coast is a better play than anything in the Rust Belt.

    Profile photo of Don NicolussiDon Nicolussi
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    There is a term often used, "never try and catch a falling sword." There is no need to try and pick the bottom of market. Above all this story reminds me just how lucky we are here in Australia.

    Don Nicolussi | Mortgage Broker - Home Loan Warehouse
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    Profile photo of Nigel KibelNigel Kibel
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    I think you also have to consider why would you invest your money in such a bad market when there are still great opportunities in the United States. To me there is no real upside in Detroit where many other states are now in recover and growth mode.

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    Profile photo of FreckleFreckle
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    Nigel Kibel wrote:
    many other states are now in recover and growth mode.

    It's argued that as many as 32  states are technically insolvent – bankrupt. Only a few states have any real growth and much of that growth is driven by the exodus from other states as one after the other they struggle to hold on with debt growing faster than GSP. The vast majority of US GDP growth is supported by QE policy and printing. Without it the US is dead in the water. 

    The clock's running on the US and time is running out. I see nothing on the horizon that will prevent an eventual collapse at this point. Globally there's a rising tide of economic effort going into putting the US back in its place. I give it a decade at most.

    The US market is a speculators market not an investors market. Has been for a while now.

    Profile photo of saturdaysaturday
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    HI Freckle, what are your thoughts on the A$ v US$ ? The admission from the US that they need to continue with the stimulus did not seem to have a major effect, i would have thought it would have put the A$ back at 97 odd?

    Profile photo of FreckleFreckle
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    saturday wrote:
    HI Freckle, what are your thoughts on the A$ v US$ ?

    Difficult. I think the overall trend will be down against the US. Maybe 0.85. The current pressures are more to do with China weakness than US Fed policy, however, we supposedly have a 'taper' happening around Sep13. I think this could be a smoke and mirrors act though.  

    Quote:
    The admission from the US that they need to continue with the stimulus did not seem to have a major effect, i would have thought it would have put the A$ back at 97 odd?

    It had an initial impact. Interest rates went up, bond markets got volatile, and other markets jumped around a bit then they realised it won't happen for a while if ever. 

    The problem with currencies today is that all major economies are in trouble and CB's are manipulating their currencies for all they're worth. The A$ has weakened against all major currencies so the driver is the AU economy and its future outlook. Given the RBA is likely to push rates lower the outlook isn't encouraging.

    What had me concerned was not the deteriorating situation but the timing. I saw this happening 3 years ago but the pullback is earlier than my initial predictions. I didn't expect the A$ to pull back for another 18 months nor as fast.  

    What has me concerned at the moment is the shear number of things that are deteriorating and the growing size of these problems.

    Watch China. All is not what it seems there. They're playing the long game in world economic domination.  They just pulled the pin on credit lines for over producing industries including steel. That doesn't bode well for coking coal or iron ore. Our terms of Trade will continue to deteriorate as well. 

    I expect KRudd to pull Labour out of the fire and if they can maintain their current popularity will take the next election. I would think Labour will bring more creative and innovative economic policy to the table not forgetting their execution leaves a lot to be desired. That's not to suggest it'll be the right policy at the right time but it will keep the sheeple believing in miracles for a bit longer. If they can hold the economy together through the China shakeout you might see the A$ start to rise again in 18 months subject to whatever the embiciles at the FED do of course.

    Profile photo of saturdaysaturday
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    thanks for your comments Freckle. I appreciate your time to answer the question. I did not really understand the taper term so for others that may also not be familiar with this term see below                                Federal Reserve officials really don’t like the word “tapering” — one of the most popular buzzwords in the markets these days.

    AFP/Getty Images

    The Federal Reserve building in Washington.The Merriam-Webster dictionary defines the verb to taper as “to become progressively smaller toward one end.”

    Stock and bond market investors and many television commentators regularly use tapering as shorthand for the Fed gradually reducing its monthly bond purchases.

    The hangup for Fed officials is the word “tapering” suggests a slow, steady and predictable reduction from the current level of $85 billion a month at a succession of Fed meetings, say to $65 billion per month, then to $45 billion and so on. And that’s not necessarily what Fed officials envision.

    Because Fed officials are uncertain about the economic outlook and the pros and cons of their own program, they might reduce their bond purchases once and then do nothing for a while. Or they might cut their bond buying once and then later increase it if the economy falters. Or they might indeed reduce their purchases in a series of steps if warranted by economic developments — but they don’t want the markets to think that’s a set plan. It is, as Fed officials like to say, “data dependent.”

    That’s why the Fed’s most senior officials avoid the word. Fed Chairman Ben Bernanke never uttered the word “taper” in his March press conference; nor did he use it in more than two hours of congressional testimony last month. Instead, he said then, “in the next few meetings, we could take a step down in our pace of purchases.”

    New York Fed president William Dudley also has been avoiding the word. Instead, he’s talked about wanting to “reduce the pace at which we are adding accommodation through asset purchases.”

    Nevertheless, analysts can’t stop talking about tapering.

    “Before today’s number our call for a first tapering was on a knife-edge between September and December,” J.P. Morgan economist Michael Feroli said in a note to clients Friday morning;

    “No Tapering (Yet) by the Fed,” IHS Global Insight economist Nariman Behravesh said;

    “Liquidity bulls gashed by Fed tapering fears,” said Bank of America investment strategist Michael Hartnett.

    To be fair, the analysts became attached to the word taper after it was used a few times by the Fed itself.

    The term showed up twice in minutes to the Fed’s March policy meeting. It showed up once in the April minutes, though then it was only associated with Fed dissenter Esther George, president of the Kansas City Fed, who wanted to end the bond-buying program then.

    The Fed has fought rhetorical battles with investors in the past and lost.  Officials disliked the obscure term “quantitative easing,” often used in the markets to describe their bond buying program. Instead officials tried an equally obscure term, long-term asset purchases, to describe it. But the market has stuck with quantitative easing, or QE.

    It will likely lose the battle over the term “tapering.” But don’t expect to hear the term cross Mr. Bernanke’s lips.

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