All Topics / Help Needed! / Advice Needed – asbestos in a house

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  • Profile photo of Chickster01Chickster01
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    @chickster01
    Join Date: 2011
    Post Count: 4

    Hey everyone – I'm new here so be gentle :)
    I am in the market to purchase my first home & have found a property I love.
    The owner is selling directly & upon viewing was open & told me that there was asbestos in the walls in the dining/kitchen area. The outside of the house is the 'lookalike' weatherboards that don't need painting (does this stuff contain asbestos too?)
    My main question – I understand the risk asbestos can pose – but also understand that unless disturbed is harmless to the house dweller.  I also understand the process of removal although haven't looked into costs if this was ever required.
    From what I have read online, it seems the majority of houses pre-80's will most likely contain some form of asbestos – so is the asbestos being present a reason NOT to buy this house?
    I believe it is well priced in the market – there isn't too much potential to develop the house past its current condition as it is a very tidy well kept & well renovated house – and the cost to extend past a 2brm house probably isn't viable for this property. I am buying it not for the investment but as a home for my son & I but I don't want to see myself sitting in a house that doesn't appreciate in value with the market due to containing asbestos.  Since asbestos seems so widely spread – does this really put people off buying a house? 
    Your valued experience & opinions are appreciated.  I need to make a move either way on this house in the next couple of weeks so if you could post your answers as soon as that would be wonderful.

    Cheers, Amanda

    Profile photo of DaveVelascoDaveVelasco
    Member
    @davevelasco
    Join Date: 2011
    Post Count: 1

    Well, if you are not sure with it, why not try to hire some professional in home inspecting before first getting your chosen home? It's better sometimes than just doing it on your own. The cost might be there, but it would be worth the effort if you do. <moderator: delete advertising>

    Profile photo of Bruce from BrisyBruce from Brisy
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    @bruce-from-brisy
    Join Date: 2010
    Post Count: 11

    Hi Amanda…this is quite long so grab a coffee….first off these are just my opinions so feel free to get a second opinion…the look alike weatherboard stuff is probably cladding with a foam backing, generally not asbestos. It usual does not need painting as it is an aluminium product. However, it may have been placed over fibro sheeting (asbestos) to dress up the look of house. Generally houses built in 1990 or before will carry asbestos. To test a piece (about the size of a 50 cent piece – triple bagged and sent to a authorised testing facility (look up asbestos testing on web) I use – http://www.queenslandlab.com 22 Ereton Drive, Arundel Qld contact 1300 138 366. Call them and they shall info you procedure it cost $55 incl gst per test. They test piece immediately provided you have a credit card and then they info you over telephone and send a report through via email or mail. If not in Qld I am sure you can find an alternative. I have purchased properties with asbestos and if minimal doesn’t pose a problem – if your just washing it and painting all is good (the key is not to disturb it). Plenty of people buy houses for investment to reside in or rent out which contains asbestos. So I wouldn’t get too hung up on that issue.

    The general rule with asbestos is depending on which council area you are in they tend to have slightly different mechanisms for dealing with and disposing of this product. You are correct if not damaged and undisturbed it doesn’t pose a problem. Even drilling, sanding, cutting, breaking or damaging it in any way permits the particulars to disburse into the air – this is a big no no. I have dropped some info from a guide as per below for you. Also here is a website regarding same and licences etc:

     http://www.deir.qld.gov.au/workplace/training/training/activities/asbestosremoval/bclass/index.htm

    There would be similar in what ever council you are in – go to your council website and search for asbestos.

    However, the general rule (please check with your council) if following your particular council is that provided you are not removing more than 10m2 (equivalent to one bathroom wall) at a time, and you are adhering to the removal and safety precautions – you can do it yourself. Also there are specific guidelines concerning taking it to council smart dumps for disposal. In Logan (Qld) Council smart tips it cost around $14 per 100 kgs. Of course it has to be bagged and tagged prior to delivery and at this specific council you must ring tip 1 hour before arrival. It cost me in disposable coveralls (3pr, goggles, P1 or P2 asbestos masks (YOU CANNOT USE A NORMAL DUST MASK), duck tape, black plastic as per below, gloves and bags to cover boots, water spray bottle – about $200 neat. You make bags doubled wrapped so 2 x men can lift easily into a trailer. Quotes were about $1500-$3000 for someone to do it. To do a 3 bed small cottage inside and outside is about $13K. To be honest after observing some of these guys do their asbestos removal I wouldn’t want to go near the house afterwards. There are obviously licensed asbestos removalists who are very competent.

    This fact sheet has been adapted from the Public Health Regulation 2005 and the 2005 NOHSC Code of Practice for the Management and Control of Asbestos.

    REMOVING CERAMIC TILES FROM ASBESTOS SHEETING

    IMPORTANT INFORMATION:

    Asbestos is a hazardous substance.

    It is a risk to your health and the health of those around you if asbestos fibres become

    airborne.

    Plan ahead to avoid disturbing materials containing asbestos.

    Always prevent creating any dust.

    Follow the correct safety procedures.

    STEP 1. Get your equipment together

    • 0.2mm thick plastic bags no more than 1200mm long and 900mm wide for collection of

    asbestos waste

    • 0.2mm thick plastic sheeting as a drop sheet

    • Duct tape

    • Bucket of water and spray bottle filled with detergent and water

    • Wide scraper, hammer and chisel

    • Disposable cleaning rags (eg. paper, cloth)

    • Personal protective equipment – P1 or P2 respirator, disposable coveralls, safety

    goggles and disposal gloves

    STEP 2. Prepare the work area

    • Remove all loose and unnecessary items from the work area

    • Close doors and restrict entry

    • Cover the floor with plastic sheeting and secure with duct tape

    • Keep asbestos waste separate to all other waste

    • Put on your personal protective equipment

    • Check the fit of your respirator as per manufacturer’s instructions

    Warning!

    Check for electrical hazards. As you will be using water in this task, it is safest to turn off all

    electricity where you are working to prevent electrocution.

    STEP 3. Remove wall tiles

    • Use the chisel to gently tap between the top of the tile and the backing sheet to release

    the tile (do not dig the chisel into the backing sheet)

    • As the tile is released, spray detergent water lightly behind the tile to prevent release of

    fibres

    • Try to prevent the tile from falling onto the plastic

    • Place tiles in disposal bags (only fill the bag half full)

    • Remove tile adhesive and grout residue from backing sheet to achieve a relatively flat

    and clean surface before laying new tiles. Treat all waste as asbestos waste.

    If the backing sheet is damaged or broken before or during the removal of the tiles, you’ll need

    to remove the entire sheet. You’ll also need to remove the entire sheet if you can’t remove the

    tiles without damaging the backing sheet. Arrange for the sheet to be removed by a

    professional or remove it yourself using the “Removing Bonded Materials Containing Asbestos”

    This fact sheet has been adapted from the Public Health Regulation 2005 and the 2005 NOHSC Code of

    Practice for the Management and Control of Asbestos.

    procedure. Replace the asbestos sheeting with an alternative wall lining (eg. plywood,

    plasterboard, fibre cement sheeting).

    STEP 4. Clean up

    • Use a cloth and detergent water to gently wipe down the wall. Keep the surface damp

    with the detergent spray. Use a scraper to gently remove all residues and do not dig

    into the surface of the sheet

    • With the wall sheeting now clean and level, wipe down again with a damp detergentwater

    cloth

    • Remove larger scraps from ground plastic sheet and place in a disposal bag

    • Carefully roll or fold plastic sheeting from the floor, so any collected dust or debris does

    not spill

    Warning!

    Domestic vacuum cleaners are unsuitable and should never be used, even if they have a HEPA

    filter.

    • If necessary, use damp rags and/or an approved asbestos vacuum cleaner to clean any

    remaining visibly contaminated sections of the work area

    • Do not resoak used rags in the bucket, as this will contaminate the water. Either fold

    the rag and use the clean surface or use a new rag.

    • Place asbestos debris, used rags, plastic sheeting and other asbestos waste in disposal

    bags (only half fill the bag – this is to reduce the chance of the bag splitting)

    • After the work area is clean, wet down your personal protective equipment and clothing

    with a light spray of water and place them and all used damp cloths into a disposable

    bag

    • Before removing the bags from the work area, wipe external surfaces with damp rags

    to remove any dust and put the used rags in one of the bags

    • Seal all disposal bags with duct tape, place into a second disposal bag and seal again

    • Label all bags with an appropriate warning such as:

    CAUTION – ASBESTOS

    DO NOT DAMAGE OR OPEN BAG

    DO NOT INHALE DUST

    CANCER AND LUNG DISEASE HAZARD

    • Dispose of asbestos waste at the appropriate waste facility (contact your local Council

    for more information).

    Profile photo of tvpropertytvproperty
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    @tvproperty
    Join Date: 2010
    Post Count: 27
    Chickster01 wrote:
    The outside of the house is the 'lookalike' weatherboards that don't need painting (does this stuff contain asbestos too?)

    And what's under these "lookalike" boards?  I've seen cladding go straight over the top of an asbestos sheet house!

    Chickster01 wrote:
    Since asbestos seems so widely spread – does this really put people off buying a house?

    I reckon it'll always reduce the price and the buyer pool……by how much, who knows.

    Profile photo of Chickster01Chickster01
    Participant
    @chickster01
    Join Date: 2011
    Post Count: 4

    Hey thanx for your posts everyone – especially you Bruce, thankyou for all the effort you put into replying.

    Yes I am buying in QLD – so it would be as you have mentioned above.  House with Asbestos back in NZ don't seem to be as common so I have little experience in knowing what the market view is of asbestos in houses – i.e. in NZ it would dramatically affect your resale potential where as from what I can gather here in QLD you are almost guaranteed to have some form of asbestos in your house if it is built pre-80 – surely with stats that high, the fact that asbestos is in a house must be just part & parcel of buying a place & is something that although considered isn't enough to drive a buyer out the door again???

    I will definately be looking deeper into what is behind the scenes of this house though to make sure that it isn't riddled i.e. under the exterior walls – and hopefully just has it in the internal walls in some rooms as previously disclosed by the owner.

    I just don't want to be sitting on a lemon in 5 years time if I decide to sell up & buy another house with the man of my dreams when I meet him hehehe (yes well dreams are free right!!!)

    Keep smilin & keep posting, every opinion is appreciated!

    Amanda

    Profile photo of CatalystCatalyst
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    @catalyst
    Join Date: 2008
    Post Count: 1,404

    The only way to avoid asbestos is to buy newer properties. Are you seeing millions of empty pre 1980 houses around? No!!!! so people buy them, live in them, renovate them.

    Sure it may cost a little more if/when you renovate but other than that what's the problem?

    All of my properties are pre 1980.

    Profile photo of Chickster01Chickster01
    Participant
    @chickster01
    Join Date: 2011
    Post Count: 4

    Thanks so much – I have decided that I don't think its going to be an issue in this house.  I will get a property inspection done (if anyone can recommend a good one that would be great!) to assess the amount of asbestos in the house but if it is only in some of the internal walls & not in the roof (very expensive to replace!) then I don't see it as an issue.

    Again thank you for the replies – I feel much better about it all now :)

    Cheers, Amanda

    Profile photo of Bruce from BrisyBruce from Brisy
    Participant
    @bruce-from-brisy
    Join Date: 2010
    Post Count: 11

    Hi Amanda

    https://www.propertyinvesting.com/strategies/renovations
    This link above is great info from Steve McKnight regarding what (I believe) one should really stay away from if you do not have the reno knowledge or think you can sort out those problem areas during the reno – and believe me he's correct as I know this from personal experience. Generally speaking as Steve says, the more costly areas to fix are:

    Roof (leaks, rotting areas)
    Stumps (sloping floors and walls)
    Rewiring and replumbing (old circuitry and copper pipes)
    Shower recesses
    Pest (particularly white ant) damage

    Also not every paid house inspection picks up the hidden items that would cost you and I profit to repair.  The expectation of a buyer is that there is a roof with 4 walls etc etc not what we do behind the scene. They don’t care how much effort and expense we have gone into to product this wonderful asset. The profit is in the buy not the sell as the market determines what the buyer shall purchase it for.

    Do not stray from the plan – Dean and Elise Parker from:

    (http://www.propertysystems.com.au/reno-expert-dean-and-elise.html) have a great package concerning the renovation system and it works – provided you stick to it. It’s business – don’t get emotional with the property – If you are buying it to reside in it for 5 years or so then you shall treat it as your principle place of residence. If you are buying it to sell in 5 years – you are still living there, though you have another agenda. Recognise that and stick to a plan. Through Steve’s, Dean’s and Elise’s knowledge and direction you can make it work. Learn from those who have done it and are doing it – it’s cheaper to spend some money on some Conferences, courses and books than fork out $50K and realise that you made a mistake.

    Don’t forget to have fun – Regards Bruce

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