Okay well what if my grandfather is not the trustee? Then I have to make contact with the trustee of the trust which may be a representative of a company…..
You said above you think the trustee is a company. In that case the director(s) of the company is the one who does it.
Terryw | Structuring Lawyers Pty Ltd / Loan Structuring Pty Ltd
http://www.Structuring.com.au
Email MeLawyer, Mortgage Broker and Tax Advisor (Sydney based but advising Aust wide) http://www.Structuring.com.au
Okay, yeh I said I think my grandfather is the director and the company of my grandfather is the trustee. Okay in that case my grandfather is able to change the deed.
Also if I can convice my grandfather to make me or my father the next appointer then once it occurs say for example my father is the appointer then he may employ me to become the trustee at which point we take control of the trust. Then which ever one of us is the trustee is able to determine who is to be beneficiaries and how much they receive, ect.
Additionally either one of us or both are able to also be beneficiaries at the same time, correct?
I think you are confusing yourself again. If the company is the trustee then your grandfather is probably just director.
down the track you wouldn't want to be trustee as there is some risk to taking on the role and you would also have to change title deeds to all property of the trust. Best to get a company as trustee and you be director of the company and control its shares.
Terryw | Structuring Lawyers Pty Ltd / Loan Structuring Pty Ltd
http://www.Structuring.com.au
Email MeLawyer, Mortgage Broker and Tax Advisor (Sydney based but advising Aust wide) http://www.Structuring.com.au
Thats what I said, I said I think my grandfathers company is the trustee and grandfather is the director. Just let me know one thing for sure. Can the director change the trust deed or not?
It depends on the trust deed. If the trust deed permits it and if the director is the sole director of the trustee company then they can resolve to amend the deed.
Terryw | Structuring Lawyers Pty Ltd / Loan Structuring Pty Ltd
http://www.Structuring.com.au
Email MeLawyer, Mortgage Broker and Tax Advisor (Sydney based but advising Aust wide) http://www.Structuring.com.au
Its probably the guardian/appointor that can appoint another or a replacement appointor. You really have to read the deed as this contains the rules for the trust.
Terryw | Structuring Lawyers Pty Ltd / Loan Structuring Pty Ltd
http://www.Structuring.com.au
Email MeLawyer, Mortgage Broker and Tax Advisor (Sydney based but advising Aust wide) http://www.Structuring.com.au
Terryw wrote:I think you are confusing yourself again. If the company is the trustee then your grandfather is probably just director.down the track you wouldn't want to be trustee as there is some risk to taking on the role and you would also have to change title deeds to all property of the trust. Best to get a company as trustee and you be director of the company and control its shares.
Also, if at some point down the track dad becomes appointer then he is able to change the deed so I become director of the company which controls shares of the estate?
The company is totally separate and is governed by the corporations act and constitution of the company. A company is basically controlled by the shareholders who can vote and appoint the director. So you would have to get the shares or 51% of the controlling shares to appoint yourself OR have the shareholders appoint you.
Terryw | Structuring Lawyers Pty Ltd / Loan Structuring Pty Ltd
http://www.Structuring.com.au
Email MeLawyer, Mortgage Broker and Tax Advisor (Sydney based but advising Aust wide) http://www.Structuring.com.au
By saying "Get the shares" do you mean I would need to own 51% or more of shares in my own name? Could the appointer arrange that? If not, then who?
BTW I should mention that a guardian could be another term for an appointor or it could be another position altogether. You really need to read the deed to determine what the role and powers of each player are.
As for the company. It is totally separate to the trust. So the appointor has no power over it. What you want is control over the shares. You can buy the share from the existing owner.
Or
You can form a new company from stratch. Have the shares in your name or in a separate trust which you control. You can then hold a shareholder meeting and vote to make yourself director. At the same time you as appointor of the trust can sack the old trustee and appoint your new company as trustee.
Terryw | Structuring Lawyers Pty Ltd / Loan Structuring Pty Ltd
http://www.Structuring.com.au
Email MeLawyer, Mortgage Broker and Tax Advisor (Sydney based but advising Aust wide) http://www.Structuring.com.au
Okay, sounds like a bit of a process. For the time being I will just focus on getting the role of appointer transfered to me or my father. Then I need to figure out how the other one of us may become director
Is it possible that director is also the appointer?
yes
Terryw | Structuring Lawyers Pty Ltd / Loan Structuring Pty Ltd
http://www.Structuring.com.au
Email MeLawyer, Mortgage Broker and Tax Advisor (Sydney based but advising Aust wide) http://www.Structuring.com.au
Sounds like I will need some time to read through and disect the trust deed.
Also, if the solicitor has a copy of the trust deed, then may I make a copy of it with the permission of the trustee?
He may say I can only have look at it. I might have to take some photos…
hopefully grandad has a copyProbably. The trustee should be able to request a copy – maybe a fee will be charged. The accountant may also have it or a copy.
Terryw | Structuring Lawyers Pty Ltd / Loan Structuring Pty Ltd
http://www.Structuring.com.au
Email MeLawyer, Mortgage Broker and Tax Advisor (Sydney based but advising Aust wide) http://www.Structuring.com.au
Thanks again Terry. Tomorow im going to ring the solictor and the accountant to find out if they have a copy.
good luck
Terryw | Structuring Lawyers Pty Ltd / Loan Structuring Pty Ltd
http://www.Structuring.com.au
Email MeLawyer, Mortgage Broker and Tax Advisor (Sydney based but advising Aust wide) http://www.Structuring.com.au
Rang solicitor and accountant. Solicitor has copy of will and also a certificate of title to a property.
I am quite certain the accountant has a copy of the trust deed, she however is going to have a look for it and im calling her later today to find out more.Terry what do you know about the certificate of titles to properties?
Certificate of title will list the legal owner which is the trustee. You can determine if the owner is a company or your grand dad, but not if they held the property as trustee.
What do you need to know?
Terryw | Structuring Lawyers Pty Ltd / Loan Structuring Pty Ltd
http://www.Structuring.com.au
Email MeLawyer, Mortgage Broker and Tax Advisor (Sydney based but advising Aust wide) http://www.Structuring.com.au
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