Forums / Property Investing / Help Needed! / Advertising Billboards As An Investment

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  • Profile photo of dallen_14dallen_14
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    @dallen_14
    Join Date: 2008
    Post Count: 10

    I was recently at the Steve McKnight Seminar in Brisbane and he used an example of an advertising billboard as a cashflow investment. This sounds appealing as it appears to have a small start up cost when compared to other property deals. ($30,000 for the sign to be made and placed, plus land, taxes and fees).
    Just some quick questions though
    1). How do you find advertisers (tenants). Do you have to do it all yourself or are their advertising agencies who can help you sell the space?
    2). If anyone has done it before what did you find to be the biggest hurdles (Did you get ambushed by council fees etc)?
    3). Would it fall under the ‘Commercial Property Bracket as far as tax?
    4). Any tips for starting of?
    5). Do you have any advice on how to pick your locations. eg finding traffic data etc?

    Any tips and/or experiences would be greatly appreciated!

    Cheers
    Dave

    Profile photo of ScampScamp
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    @scamp
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    [Edited for offensive and irrelevant content]

    Profile photo of TerrywTerryw
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    @terryw
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    Commercial Property is taxed the same as any other property.

    Terryw | Structuring Lawyers / Loan Structuring Pty Ltd
    http://propertytaxbook.com.au/
    Email Me

    Lawyer, Mortgage Broker and Tax Advisor (Aust wide) http://propertytaxbook.com.au/

    Profile photo of dallen_14dallen_14
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    @dallen_14
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    hahaha whoaa…. Holy cow, take a chill pill Scamp, just asking a question, why you Mr Kranky pants!! I never claimed to be an expert…. PS I do have a job, its in Newspaper Advertising. Anyway back to business

    Does anyone have experience with advertising billboards that will be able to give me some advice on starting out.
    Are there advertising agencies who help in finding clients for national sales campaigns?

    I figure just like newspapers advertising, I noticed that the clients brought in by nationals sales campaigns pay a lot more dough than what can be found by the local ad sales reps.

    Anyway any CONSTRUCTIVE advice would be greatly appreciated.

    Cheers
    Dave

    Profile photo of Michael 888Michael 888
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    @michael-888
    Join Date: 2005
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    Hi Dave,

    in Melbourne I have noticed that many of the signs are owned/managed by Cody Signs. Not sure where you are situated, however have a look at some of the large signage in your locality and usually at the bottom there will be an indication of who runs the sign.

    Also not sure what you own as far as commercial property, however you could also look at leasing out roof space on any comm IP's you own for telco towers. I tried achieving this with telstra, optus, three and voda, unfortunately they all had nearby towers and no further need for now. You never know unless you ask……if you never ask, the answer will always be NO!

    Good Luck.

    Profile photo of js2js2
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    @js2
    Join Date: 2003
    Post Count: 758

    I'm going to walk flyers around local businesses to seek expressions of interest. I have to seek council approval to put a bill board before i take that step.

    Profile photo of keikokeiko
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    @keiko
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    bit harsh scamp, anyway why wouldn't you invest in this when the economy is going down hill you would have to be a fall scamp not to find other ways to get your business extra work while things are slow, So iam sure billboard advertising would work unless you have no brain to think outside the square scamp

    Profile photo of dallen_14dallen_14
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    @dallen_14
    Join Date: 2008
    Post Count: 10

    Haha, Cheers Keiko, I was blown away with that. That was the 1st time I ever wrote anything on this forum and that was my 1st ever reply. So yer I was a bit worried that my brain was the size of a pea for a day. But as some say, size doesn’t matter, its how you use it. (my brain that is)

    Also Cheers Mike 888
    Telco towers, ha I never even thought of that. What a brilliant idea!
    On the way to work today I looked around and it is mostly Cody and APN Outdoor (Brisbane) so Ill give them a call and see if they have info about vacancy rates and monthly potential incomes etc (all the stats I need) and see if they can give me a bit of insight.

    Jaffa that is a clever way to probe which locations its even worth building a billboard in on the 1st place (not to mention very cheap). Nice one. Are you trying to build one now yourself are you?

    Anyway This is the type of stuff I’m looking for. If there is anymore I would love to hear it.

    Cheers
    Dave

    Profile photo of js2js2
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    @js2
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    dallen_14 wrote:
    Are you trying to build one now yourself are you?

    Yep, going to look into it. It dawned on me that I could potentially put one or two billboards on the side of this building I own, as it's 7 meter high brick by 14 meters and faces side on for a perfect view of passing traffic. Not in a larger town where billboards are common but possibly might work for this unique situation if A). Council give the OK and B). I can find someone to advertise. C). The number come out worth while.

    Which reminds me i really should get down to Council to look into it!

    Profile photo of C2C2
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    @c2
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    dallen_14,

    Cost depends on the type of billboard.
    I had a sign made up for a building I was renting and sold advertising spaces for businesses that complimented my business.

    Scamp,

    A billboard can have multiple advertisers including dallen_14's.  You don't need a brain bigger than a pea to know that.
    Economics 101 when businesses want to increase profits they normally look at some form of advertising, especially if their business is finding it tough.  How else do you expect them to find new customers.

    Also a bit disappointing that you feel the need to try and degrade a newbie poster who is trying to think out side of the square.  How about trying to put a positive spin and encourage rather than belittle members.
    Negative comments of a constructive nature are always welcome.

    Profile photo of BozenaBozena
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    @bozena
    Join Date: 2008
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    Sounds interesting……….It's way over my head though.  However,does anyone know what amount of $ approx they usually charge to ustilise the space for an ad? 

    Profile photo of crashycrashy
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    @crashy
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    I know of a house with billboard for sale, returning 8%+. QLD

    finders fee :)

    msg me

    Profile photo of dallen_14dallen_14
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    @dallen_14
    Join Date: 2008
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    This is great guys. I just made a few phone calls and it looks like APN has taken over Cody and according to the sales rep there, they only find customers for the billboards they actually own. (I was hoping it might be similar to the way you can use a real estate agency to find tenants for an investment house). But hey there might be a an new business opportunity there…. (It would be a lot of work and risk though)

    So from what I have been told so far, it looks like we have to find our own customers (advertisers), and I will probably use Jaffas method.

    C2 if you don’t mind me asking do you remember roughly what it cost you when you did it? Did you get any surprise blow outs in your budget? Did it work well for you, would you do it again if you could go back in time. (And cheers for those comments!)

    Jaffa I will be really keen to see how you go. Best of luck sport. I hope the Council approval goes well!

    Boneza
    In the example where Steve McKnight showed us what he did with one of his Billboards, his yearly yield was $11500. And he paid $123,375 for it. He showed us some funky thing we can do with claiming the GST (Which is all honesty I don’t completely understand yet) where he got $10681 back from the tax office.

    Profile photo of cool samcool sam
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    @cool-sam
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    Step1

    Advertise vacant property for rent.

    Step2

    Show available property for rent and interview prospective tenants.

    Step3

    Screen the best candidates for your rental property by requiring written applications with credit and employment references.

    Step4

    Evaluate prospective tenants by investigating their backgrounds, credit histories, personal references and employment histories.

    Step5

    Obtain liability, fire, theft and other insurance on rental property.

    Step6

    Arrange for regular maintenance and necessary repairs of the property.

    Step7

    Assure that tenants comply with rental policies and procedures.

    Step8

    Supervise repairs and maintenance work.

    Step9

    Conduct inspections of the property on a periodic basis.

    Step10

    Establish and maintain an organized system of collecting rental payments and security deposits.

    __________________________________________________________

    Belize Condos  Belize Real Estate Dominican Republic CondosDominican Republic Real Estate

    Profile photo of C2C2
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    @c2
    Join Date: 2002
    Post Count: 518

    Dallen,

    Will check if I still have the figures and dimensions but it was a few years back.

    A few pointers.

    1) The board was made up by a friend so was done on mates rates about 5×2.

    2) Design the adverts before approaching potential customers.

    3) I used placards that were interchangeable so the order could be varied fortnightly.

    Profile photo of joshua.moorejoshua.moore
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    @joshua.moore
    Join Date: 2006
    Post Count: 14

    Hi Dallen_14,

    I think it is great you have posted your queries online. Asking for advice is a great step as it helps to clarify your thoughts while also allowing you to receive input from others.

    I am assuming the Billboard deal you are talking about is the same deal from Steve's 3rd book, however if it is not some of the following information will still be useful.

    Personally, I think one of the reasons behind this example from Steve was to show that:

    1. There are still decent investments in the market if you know what you are looking for.
    2. Success comes from doing things differently.

    Steve wrote the last comment in my book last year when he signed it for me. Every time I see it I think about the importance of differentiating myself from the masses. Steve did that with this investment (everyone else was looking for specific houses, Steve moved to alternative commercial property investments.).

    My point is that Steve mentioned last year in my R.E.S.U.L.T.S. mentoring that he had since sold the Billboard and moved onto other investments. As people are now buzzing about the ideas of billboards, Steve is looking at other ideas that people are overlooking, while ensuring he is meeting his property investing goals and objectives.

    If billboards seem to meet your goals and objectives in relation to property investing then I would recommend finding a guerrilla marketing strategy (see guerrilla marketing warfare for more info… Google it), as it will allow you to save finances in advertising while going straight to the customers of your product (which is Billboard space.). If you are looking at developing and placing the signs then I would recommend doing additional research into the placement of Billboards and those who make the decisions for placement of them.

    Hope this helps.

    Profile photo of dallen_14dallen_14
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    @dallen_14
    Join Date: 2008
    Post Count: 10

    Hi Josh thanks for that Post.

    After looking into it for a bit and weighing the pros and cons I will probably be holding of from it for now. If I owned property near a major road I would go ahead as it would be bonus income, but the threat of vacancy is too high for my liking for it to be a sole source of paying back a debt. And with no advertising agencies to connect me to national advertisers it further deteriorates this as an option. (Every battle is won or lost before it is fought).

    I still learnt a bit though and next time I buy a property Ill be trying to get something near a main road, so I can use the billboard as potential side income.

    Cheers for that tip about Guerilla marketing, I looked it up and yer sounds great, (I am a little bit of a history dork). Hopefully one day Ill master the Art Of Bing Fa to investing ;) I am one of probably a million people who is on the verge of launching a new website so at least Ill be able to apply the tactics for that in the mean time.

    But again thanks for your comments!

    Cheers
    Dave

    Profile photo of joshua.moorejoshua.moore
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    @joshua.moore
    Join Date: 2006
    Post Count: 14

    Your Welcome,

    Also check out the 22 immutable laws of marketing by Al Ries and Jack Trout. They cover a lot of essential marketing knowledge that is good for entrepreneurs trying to bootstrap in the initial stages of a venture to save money.

    Keep refining your goals and working towards them, while you might not have found a property you can still be practicing the numbers while also managing your personal finances to increase your savings and thus your investing capital and leverage.

    Profile photo of joshua.moorejoshua.moore
    Member
    @joshua.moore
    Join Date: 2006
    Post Count: 14

    Also check out http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marketing_warfare_strategies for additional information relating to Marketing warfare (Guerilla tactics are one type, but the most commonly used for people who are not McDonalds, Coca Cola, etc.)

    Profile photo of js2js2
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    @js2
    Join Date: 2003
    Post Count: 758

    I got the Council letter with a permit approval. Now on onto the stage b). of this to find who wants to put signs up. 

    hehe… lol i went to McDonald's today  to ask the managers, see if i can get some money back for all the McDonlad's burgers i've eaten.  

    I think the tough part for people putting a sign up (meaning my client) will be the cost to make the sign. I'm going to be $397 per annum for any slot and each sign could cover an area of between 1.5 -2 mtrs wide and 2 mtrs hieght,  made of tin to fathen directly to the brick. To create a mosiac of advertisments to fill the wall area of 8 by 4 meters. 

      

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