Hello
I have an IP with two AC units. One in the master bedroom which works fine and one in the living area which doesn't. The comment from the tenant is that with a temperature of over 35 degrees it doesn't work. It has just been serviced and the AC person said it was around 30 years old.
I have asked my PM but have as yet received no answer. Am I obliged to replace the unit given that Melbourne now a days regularly seems to have temperatures over the 40's?
I did get the AC person to give me a quote for replacement and the brand he recommended was Daikin though he did give me a quote for two other brands as well. Panasonic and Conia. Someone who I have used for renovations offered to get a Mitsubishi which he says is the very best ? for a good price from his neighbour who sells them. Any one have any comments or experience with any of these?
Also can some one please explain why there are 2 separate charges listed as well. Electrical which makes sense to me ( I assume installation ) but also for refrigeration which doesn't.
I have never installed an AC and am too far away to go around and get all the information so would appreciate any advise or comments.
Thanks in advance
ElkaElka, yes, you are obliged to maintain the amenities in the property. And given that it's 30 years old, I think you've gotten your money's worth out of that air-con!
Having bought about 25 air-con units the past 5 years, I can tell you that this is an area rife with over-quoting. You should be able to pick up a no-name split system for about $400 (I buy them off the internet) and have it installed for about $500, so you shouldn't have to pay more than $1K total. (Or a bit more if it's a large open plan area and you need a more powerful unit, or if you have a difficult installation.)
I buy the absolute cheapest unit that I can – for both myself and for tenants – and I've not had any problems with my "no name" units. Even if I do, given that they're about 1/3 or 1/4 the price of the brand names, if I lose one, I'll just chuck in a new one (if it's out of warranty, of course – even the dirt cheap ones came with a 3 yr warranty).
The air-con salespeople will probably try to tell you that you need an inverter – a refrigeration mechanic and air-con business owner that I know says "don't bother". These are useful in milder climates where you want the unit working at a low level, but in Australia's extreme heat the unit will pretty much work at full power all the time anyway, so there are no real energy savings to be had. And you don't pay the electricity bill anyway.
Good luck!
Elka, there are 2 parts to the AC – firstly it is powered by electricity (runs the motor/compressor/fans), secondly it has a refrigeration unit ie how else does it make cold? (Yes I know you can't make cold, you only can remove heat). AC brands are pretty much a muchness, if they have a 3 or 5 year warranty, great. Just remember that they DO NEED TO BE SERVICED BI-ANNUALLY (as they lose gas, need lubrication etc). If buying from a retailer, see if you can get an extended warranty ie up to five years.
Tracey, you big greeney. Using reverse logic to make tenants not use the airconditioning as it costs more to run an inefficient unit. How clever.
A warning on warranties……..they are not worth the paper they are written on. To prove this, the cheapest nastiest chinese units have real long warranties. WHY? the make 100,000 units then close the company and rename it.
The old a/c is probably OK, may just need a re-gas.
Buy a decent brand, or it will cost you no end of money and inconvenience. I used to work for a company who installed chinese crap, their markup was 100% and they allowed for a 50% failure rate after 2 yrs.
Buying the el cheapo chinese units is definetely a false economy. When they break down, you'll see why.
As for chucking it out and replacing it, the replacement labour cost will exceed the cost of the unit.
Also, when they do break down, it always happens in hot weather, so add warranty delays, christmas/new year holiday delays+replacement timeline and your tennant could go most of the summer without their air con.
It could get ugly and expensive!Installation costs are the same whether you use good or crap brands, so spend a little extra and get a known brand with good warranty backup.
Doesn't have to be premuim brand Daikin/Fujitsu etc, but Kelvinator/LG etc are just fine.There are so many points of view here and its great to see. As for my opinion and thats from a point where I used to sell the stuff is, if a job is worth doing its worth doing right. Sure if you buy a good name brand it will cost more but will most likely last longer and be installed by a reputable organisation. Also as for inverters not only are they more efficient energy wise they are less taxing on the compressor unit. This is because it regulates the temperature in the room more evenly and wont need to go flat out and where out faster. One thing I look for is that I also dont want to waste my time running around organising a replacement unit which takes up my time and effort that could be used elsewhere and making money.
Anyway good luck and see you all in here again.Thank you all for your opinions.
Is anyone a member at Choice ?
Hi,
I've heard Daiken is a reliable brand.
I don't think you have to provide air conditioning. I would be going back to the tenant and asking them to choose and then increasing the rent by an agreed amount to compensate.
Remember the rental multiplier effect. For instance, let's say that you negotiate for the rent to increase by $10 per week. This is unlikely to cover the cost of the unit, however, the additional rent may increase your property by a large amount.
For example, if the market yield on your property was 7%, then the additional value created by a $10 per week increase in rent would be:
($10 * 52) / .07
= $7,428Cheers,
Steve McKnight | PropertyInvesting.com Pty Ltd | CEO
https://www.propertyinvesting.comSuccess comes from doing things differently
SteveMcKnight wrote:I don't think you have to provide air conditioning.Steve, I'm assuming you missed in Elka's original post that the air-con was already there but is now not working. My understanding is that if you let your property with air-con units, you do have to maintain/repair/replace them.
Regards, Tracey in Brisbane
Hello Steve
I really hope that your wife is on the mend and will soon be home again.Hello Crashy
It was just serviced so I guess they checked the gas and in fact it is working.
Hello Tracy
Your right about if a facility is there when you let a property and it breaks down e.g AC, then you are obliged to repair it.
However my understanding from my PM is that it is working but does not cope with temperatures above 35 degrees.
It was in this situation that I wondered if I was obliged to replace it.I have a feeling that Steve is right but have still not had an answer from my PM.
What I actually want to do is to be able to delay installing a new one till March when I will be in Australia and so able to get more information, shop around a bit and also be there for the installation.
You said in your post that you pay about $500 for installation costs. Is that the norm? I have been quoted $400 for the electrical and $500 for the refrigeration. So it's $900 including all certificates of compliance etc. Too expensive?
Thank you for your interest
Elka
Depends greatly on the type of unit Elka, if it is a window rattler, they are simply 'plug & play' as all that is required is pulling the old unit out of the wall and putting the new on into the existing opening (provided that it fits the existing hole).
If you are looking at a split system (unlikely as these weren't around until early 1990's), then the electrical work comprises the connections between the two units (compressor & fan coil unit) + connection to mains (existing supply to current a.c), then there is the gas connection/refrigerant lines between the fcu & the compressor. This work is the same (only greater) if it is a ducted unit.
Most AC units will struggle with 35 degree temps – have you thought about roof insulation & shading (trees) to keep the heat out of the house?
elkam wrote:However my understanding from my PM is that it is working but does not cope with temperatures above 35 degrees.OK, probably not obliged, but if it's that old and the tenant's not happy with it's performance, I'd be inclined to replace it.
elkam wrote:You said in your post that you pay about $500 for installation costs. Is that the norm? I have been quoted $400 for the electrical and $500 for the refrigeration. So it's $900 including all certificates of compliance etc. Too expensive?Sounds spot on to me.
Thank you both for your answers. One of the reasons I want to delay replacing the unit is so that I can also look into your suggestions Scott. It's all too difficult if you can't be there to ask the right questions and see for yourself.
Cheers
Elka
another few good cheap ways to cool the house are:
paint the roof a light color
tint the windowsmy current house had an inside temp of 37 deg. roof was dark brown tiles.
painted it light cream, temp came down to 31 deg.
tinted the windows, temp came down to 27 deg.
there was insulation already.
look at keeping the heat out before you spend a lot of money getting rid of it
Hi,
I might throm my two bob in-
I recently installed two split systems into my unit, I brought the unit from Harvey Norman then pain a professional Air Con installer to install them, it can work out cheaper buying the unit yourself from a shop then paying someone to install, I found this with all the quotes I got.
I think an important point which has not been raised is the matter of insurance. If a new air con is not installed by a licenced gas/sparky it can void your insurance policy as there is no certificate of compliance. You need to obtain one of these from a licenced installer (vic) otherwise if the unit causes any damage to your IP (water leaks, faults, serges) it might not be covered by your policy.
Not worth worry about for the sake of an extra 500-1000K.
You can but good units (eg, panasonic, mitsubishi, etc) for about 600-1200K and these are about 3-6 KW easy cooling and heating a standard house or small unit.
<br /
:)” title=”>:)” class=”bbcode_smiley” />I use Conair all the time up in Darwin and have had no real problems with them. My air con guy up there says that the cheaper imports break down all the time. Conair is the cheapest brand that my air con guy will install. They cost about $500 and then another $500 to install.
If the cheaper units break down and are under warranty the company HAS to repair or replace them but often you have to send the unit in which is all too hard.
As for replacing it, I'm sure that you are under no legal obligation to replace it but if you rented a property where there were working air cons and then one broke down wouldn't you expect it to be fixed or replaced because you rented it on the basis that there were working air cons?
I just think that tenants are a really valuable asset. If a tenant makes a request and I think it is reasonable I have no problem giving them what they want. If they want replacement of something that has broken I will do it without hesitation.
Cheers
K
:)” title=”>:)” class=”bbcode_smiley” />
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