All Topics / General Property / Beware of “Bird Dogs” – from a Bird Dog!

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  • Profile photo of MiniMogulMiniMogul
    Participant
    @minimogul
    Join Date: 2002
    Post Count: 1,414

    Hi Guys

    I am writing this post because as a bird dog I do check out the competition to see what others are doing.

    I feel that some businesses are misleading.

    For example:

    one such service with a super-fancy web-site which (quoting) “specialises in helping overseas clients find and buy quality investment property in New Zealand. We provide assistance in all areas of owning and buying investment property, such as Banking and Finance, Legal, Accounting and Property Management services. Our focus on research brings a greater level of sophistication to our client’s investment decision.”

    – turns out the fee is ‘zero’ to the client because the ‘developer’ pays the fee. I.e., they are just REAL ESTATE AGENTS DIRECT MARKETING YOU PROPERTY.

    They couldn’t care less if the deal is a good one, they just want to flog it to you and get paid by the developer. Understand the difference?

    They are not working for you, they are working for themselves and the VENDOR.

    There is another person on this site posting up a storm, who used to be a RE agent for a bazillion years. (red flag, or what!?)

    Is now trying to flog off his mates’ developments and offers them to me (!!!!) to offer to my clients and then split the fee!!!!!

    Just like the first guy, full of generic fluff and bumpf about how ’90 percent of millionaires own property’ – they are not selling a DEAL, they are selling a PARTICULAR DEVELOPMENT.

    Please do not confuse these people with bird dogs or buyer’s agents. No matter how glossy the brochure or the testimonials saying ‘how easy the process was and how professional’.

    The clients targeted by these sort of operators lack the sophistication to tell a good deal from a bad. Sure, it was easy to buy, but was it a good investment? The so-called ‘bird dog’ didn’t care. It wasn’t about comparing it to other investments, it was about flogging the client the one they got the back-ender for.

    I have just got off the phone with someone wanting access to our clients to flog their so-called ‘deals’ (sic).

    This chap only liked to talk and wouldn’t listen. He kept interrupting. Finally, I asked him to please stop interrupting and let me say something.

    I then told him ‘Why would I buy a 5 percent yielding off the plan for $350 in NSW (not Sydney) town valued at $350 with no discount, other than $15k worth of ‘vendor pays stamp duty/valuation/etc’ – when in NZ we can buy ten percent yields off the plan, for anywhere between 35 percent under valuation, in cities of 250000 plus?

    At this point he muttered about ‘having been in this industry a long time’ and tried to bamboozle me with ‘experience’, which I just saw as ‘inflexible and know it all old-man’ sort of energy, ugh. Yeah, there was a good dose of sexism in there too. For example, all clients were ‘he’. Shudder. Anyway, I could have got past the sexism if the deal had been good, but it wasn’t, it was <edited>.

    I could find a better deal any day of the week – and in NSW if I thought it was time to get excited.

    Worst of all was the conflict of interest.

    I just couldn’t do it, and I don’t think you should, unless you (independently) have the knowledge to evaluate the deal.

    If the deal is good, by all means, do it. But don’t expect the seller to give you impartial advice if they are working for the vendor, if they are a REAL ESTATE AGENT!!!!

    Gee, I sound like Jenman. Jeez, he’d have a field day exposing these misleading scam artists!!!

    cheers-
    Mini

    Profile photo of shaunwalkershaunwalker
    Member
    @shaunwalker
    Join Date: 2003
    Post Count: 403

    hi barb,
    funny you should mention that, same thing happened to me with a guy wanting us to bring our clients to him for of the plan units in auckland!
    politely told him no, but not before i scammed a free dinner out of him! [biggrin]

    shaun

    Lead, Follow or get out of the bloody way

    Profile photo of Nigel KibelNigel Kibel
    Participant
    @nigel-kibel
    Join Date: 2005
    Post Count: 1,425

    The vast amount of property business out there are really just marketing companies that make anywhere from 20-30k commission on each deal and they make out they are giving you independant help. If the property is off the plan you can bet that in most cases it is a marketing company. I am glad that there are many people on this site who do not work for the vendor but for the buyer. At least the client knows what they are paying for. I also tell my clients to question everything I say because at the end of the day it is there money

    Nigel Kibel

    http://www.propertyknowhow.com.au

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    Nigel Kibel | Property Know How
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    Profile photo of redwingredwing
    Participant
    @redwing
    Join Date: 2003
    Post Count: 2,733

    I’d presume a lot of buyers agents listed under the Yellow Pages are nothing more than REA’s?

    Buyers’ Agents
    Purchasing without the stress

    For most of us, buying a home will be the largest and most expensive purchase we will ever make. It will also be the most stressful. However, by choosing to purchase through a buyers agent, you can pass this stress onto someone else.

    What is a buyers agent?
    It is generally accepted that real estate agents act largely for the vendor and the buyer has to fend for himself. However, this is changing with the emergence of buyers’ agents, who act solely on behalf of the purchaser.

    Buyers agents or buyers advocates as they are also known, have only just begun to emerge in Australia. They tend to offer two main advantages: expertise and skill in assessing properties, and the ability to make sure the client gets the property for the lowest possible price.

    They are usually former real estate agents that have experience in the whole buying and selling process. Their aim is to find a property for the buyer and negotiate the lowest possible price for their client. In some instances, they can advise against buying particular properties if they do not think they are wise purchases.

    The trend towards employing buyers agents is increasing, largely led by the insecurity many people feel about making a sensible purchase at the right price in such an over-heated market. Lack of time is another reason why purchasers turn to agents some people want to purchase but are just too busy to properly research the market. People who have moved from overseas or from interstate are also keen users of buyers agents because of their own lack of knowledge about the area into which they have moved.

    Buyers agents perform a number of functions, including:

    Sourcing properties;
    Inspecting properties for faults and resale prospects;
    Valuing properties with comparable sales;
    Bidding at auctions;
    Negotiating with vendors and real estate agents; and
    Advising on settlement matters.
    Buyers’ agents will employ a number of tactics to get a property as cheaply as possible for their clients. The techniques they use at auctions can be quite aggressive. One of their advantages is that because of their experience in the real estate industry, they are not afraid to draw attention to themselves. One common tactic is to ask whether a bid is genuine. In Victoria, for example, an auctioneer can take “dummy” bids on behalf of the vendor. Agents can usually spot dummy bids and auctioneers are required to answer honestly if asked if that is what they are.

    Agents are also very forward when it comes to asking whether the property is “on the market”, because if it is, then it will be sold to the highest bidder and not passed in. Other approaches may include standing at the front next to the auctioneer, facing the crowd, and making wisecracks or staring at other bidders to intimidate them. Drawing attention to themselves is one of their main aims, as it tends to frighten off other bidders.

    Choosing an agent
    Like any professional that you employ, you need to check the qualifications of the buyers agent you decide to use. They need to be a qualified real estate agent, preferably with considerable experience in selling. As they will be involved in negotiating with the selling agent, they need the confidence to be able to act on your behalf. Ask to speak to former clients and ascertain how many properties they buy each week or month for them. You should also find out what price range they operate in to ensure they have experience in the type of properties you are interested in purchasing.

    Buyers’ agents generally obtain a brief from the client about the type of property they are after and then they deal directly with the vendors, real estate agents or other parties such as accountants, lawyers or trustees. You also need to make sure you understand the cost of dealing with a buyers agent. They usually either take a standard fee for their service or a percentage of the purchase price. The percentage fee can vary according to whether the agent is finding the property and then buying it for you a process known as search and find or just negotiating on a property you have already found.

    Usually the fee for a search and find is about 2 per cent of the purchase price, while bidding at an auction will cost you 1 per cent of the purchase price if successful. The costs are tax-deductible for a property investor, but not for an owner-occupier.

    Buyers agents are listed in the Yellow Pages of the telephone directory under “Real Estate Buyers’ Agents”. Otherwise you can call the real estate institute in your state. Another place to look is the property buyers agents association of Australia.

    Any thoughts on the above?[smiling]

    REDWING

    “Money is a currency, like electricity and it requires momentum to make it Effective”
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    Profile photo of shake-the-diseaseshake-the-disease
    Member
    @shake-the-disease
    Join Date: 2005
    Post Count: 97
    There is another person on this site posting up a storm, who used to be a RE agent for a bazillion years. (red flag, or what!?)

    Is now trying to flog off his mates’ developments and offers them to me (!!!!) to offer to my clients and then split the fee!!!!!

    I like guessing games. How about “Green Planetary Sticker Neglect”? Am I warm?

    Profile photo of kay henrykay henry
    Member
    @kay-henry
    Join Date: 2003
    Post Count: 2,737

    “Like any professional that you employ, you need to check the qualifications of the buyers agent you decide to use. They need to be a qualified real estate agent”

    redwing, personally I prefer to deal with people who have qualifications- in any field they are working in- I believe it makes people more accountable- or they may be quality assurance built-in to that profession. It also means one can make complaints to the appropriate governing body, if warranted.

    kay henry

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