Hi all,
well after reading your posts I started doing a truckload of research on both Wandoan and Moura. Last week I took the plunge thanks to cheap fares on QF ($146 one way to Rocky) and drove out to Moura and Wandaon. [ note for those of you thinking of doing this you cant get accommodation in either town, they are booked solid 12 months out……so I stayed in Rocky]
well worth it let me tell you. at the moment Moura is in a hiatus (please forgive spelling if incorrect) but it was confirmed after not only talking with the agent but with some locals that work for Anglo, that they are indeed bringing on 50 contractors but more are to come. There are a lot properties out there but it would appear not a lot of action at the moment, no doubt some investors are having trouble getting finance I would think.
Wandoan, well there is only 2 agents in town and the guy I spoke to only had a few properties available. The rents are all over the place but some Xstrata execs are due in town around March with some major announcement due from them about April/May.
This place is simmering and will go off once the rail line is officially announced as a go ahead. Was due before Xmas but still waiting. The rail line is a joint venture between Xstrata and a number of other firms who are paying for it to be built. Once it starts the other stuff can start as well. As usual nothing is guaranteed, but the rents at the moment are being driven by the gas drilling companies and the mine construction has not even been started yet, when that starts rents will ramp up considerably.
In both towns the houses do vary greatly with most being on stumps, of a timber outside and masonite walls on the inside.
Dont expect luxury in these older places, remember its a mining town, not a resort. I can tell you the agents do get their cut with commissions though.
a guy from cockatoo constructions in moura tried to sell me building a house with them, and the cost to build a house was around $280,000 which really seems like a rip off to me, even out there where they are only 2 hrs from Rocky, its robbery. I am checking with some rocky builders to see what they might do, because if they can come in at around $220K (total turnkey)max plus $90K for the land then there could be around $100K at the back end when you sell. A corporate rental there would take a rental on a new property like that for around $450 – $500 per week minimum at this time, which would be enough for an investor to take on without any probs.
Well thats it from me
cheers
HPI would like to provide a response to some of the above post
SteveHarryPotter wrote:[ note for those of you thinking of doing this you cant get accommodation in either town, they are booked solid 12 months out……so I stayed in Rocky]Anyone who needs a bed in Wandoan can rent my fully furnished 1 bedroom cottage in the middle of town on a nightly basis @ $100 per night.
I only use it 3 or 4 times a year so it is always available, clean and serviced.HarryPotter wrote:Wandoan, well there is only 2 agents in town and the guy I spoke to only had a few properties available. The rents are all over the place but some Xstrata execs are due in town around March with some major announcement due from them about April/May.
This place is simmering and will go off once the rail line is officially announced as a go ahead. Was due before Xmas but still waiting. The rail line is a joint venture between Xstrata and a number of other firms who are paying for it to be built.The company building the rail line is ATEC and approval to commence was granted last week.
Research ATEC or Everald Compton for info.
This company is also building the Melbourne to Toowoomba link, which will result in a melbourne-brisbane-darwin link, which will be a godsend for this country.HarryPotter wrote:I can tell you the agents do get their cut with commissions though.My thoughts here as an existing owner is that Wandoan Realty, run by Ray Mortimer is the only agent to deal with.
He has a vast knowledge of the area and the customer service he provides to owners would put most agents to shame.
He looks after all maintenance, cleaning, laundry & furniture issues for me and i couldnt be happier.
I have found his overall cost to be far cheaper in the long run than the agents i use on the sunshine coast, Roxby Downs and Cairns.
This may come across as a plug, but i believe that credit should be given when its due, just as much as complaints should tooEverald Compton releases a monthly newsletter called “Everald @ Large”, always makes for very interesting reading.
I use to manage a maintenance company in Biloela which is about 70kms from Moura. I had extensive dealings with local council from 2004 to 2006 when we developed a major workshop for repairs of mining equipment and construction work on the back of all the expansion work that was due to occur in the Surat Basin and Moura area from 2009 to 2014.
Their is also talk of major LNG pipeline going from Moura into Gladstone as well.An asocciate of mine has a successful Tyre & Mechanical Service business thats for sale if anyone is interested in buying into that as well.
There is a small town called Banana about 20kms from Moura which is to be the major hub for road/rail transport for that region. The plan is for all the coal from sth queensland will come thru there to the Gladstone port instead of Brisbane, hence the upgrade to the Gladstone Coal port which has started, not sure about that one as i been in WA for a few yrs now, someone may have to verify for me.
As for property managers, you are better off going to First National in Biloela, they might only be 45mins away but they are pretty good. I still have a property their and have been using them for nearly 4 yrs.
Thats true about Banana. The problem with Banana though is that it is extremely small in size and has no services.
Hi all
definitely agree with scedds post re wandoan realty. Ray Mortimer is the guy there and he and his wife run the business together, very easygoing and he does handle everything thats required, and he is very knowledgable about the area. He also has contacts in Brisbane in the thick of things and he knows whats happening.
One needs to be renting property there to the corporates from what Ray has told me, as he rents furnished places out at $150 per room per week,,,, so a 4 bedder will rent out at $600 pw now but that will probably rise with the influx of workers there over the next few months, thus it would be best to go for 6 mth leases to start as most companies will not give up their place because once they do they will find it hard to get back in.
I must stress, if you are seriously thinking of buying in the area do your due diligence properly and visit the area. You wont be sorry. Get all the facts and make an offer. There are not many around at the moment and now the train line construction has got the approval to commence prices will most likely only go up from now on.
In Moura I dealt with Christine at Moura RE she seemed very helpful. I am now pondering wether to buy land and build, total cost about $340K with an estimated sell price current market around $450K so there should be around $90 – $100K in the back end, no tax for me as the entity has some losses to eat up. My other option is to buy a house out there for around $260K rented at $495 pw on an 80% lvr so plenty of positive cashflow there, as with the Wandoan property I am buying.
cheers
harry
I live in Moranbah and work in a mine here in mgmt and can say that things are on the move again. We have tried to buy a few properties, only to lose out to multiple offers or the house selling on the spot to someone on the agent’s buyer’s list- All well priced houses don’t make it to the internet, they all sell within the first few days. Rents are still down on what they were during the boom but still returning 7-8%, once contractors come back into town rents will tighten again. With construction of 2 new mines next year things are expected to take off again, which is why investors are snapping up houses now, before prices go silly again. From a macro perspective, coal demand and export pricing is picking up again which is good news for the industry.
I think you will find it extremely hard to rent a house in Moura for $495 a week atm
Here is an article out of today's Australia.
01/02/10 Xstrata in $15bn Queensland coalmine bonanza
ANGLO-SWISS miner Xstrata is hatching plans to build a huge 100-million-tonnes-a-year thermal coal operation in Queensland that could cost $15 billion and rival the Hunter Valley as the nation's biggest coal-producing region.
Xstrata, the world's biggest thermal coal exporter, and its Japanese joint venture partners intend to expand almost fivefold the current planned output of 22 million tonnes a year near the small town of Wandoan, 400km northwest of Brisbane, in the next 10 to 20 years.
The plans come as Xstrata chief executive Mick Davis calls an end to nearly a decade of aggressive growth by acquisition, saying his company will now focus on organic growth.
Xstrata's plans are ambitious. By comparison, Newcastle, the world's biggest coal port, ships about 90 million tonnes of coal a year, while Queensland currently produces less than 45 million tonnes a year of thermal coal.
Thermal coal is used in power stations.
Coking coal, which is higher quality, is used to make steel. It is mostly exported from Queensland.
According to the Paris-based International Energy Agency, global coal consumption is forecast to grow almost 40 per cent in the next 20 years as electricity demand increases.
Xstrata Coal's chief development officer, Jeff Gerard, told The Australian that Wandoan was expected to expand in four stages and could be producing 100 million tonnes a year sometime in the 2020s.
"Xstrata Coal is developing all of this based on a strong view of demand," Mr Gerard said yesterday. "We will be maintaining our lead position as a thermal coal exporter.
"Growing demand globally means there are a number of basins that will need to open up around the world, and Wandoan is ranked highly against all others in terms of quality, cost and proximity to port."
Last year, Xstrata tried unsuccessfully to merge with AngloAmerican in a deal that would have created Australia's biggest coal producer, among other achievements.
In a presentation at the end of last year, Mr Davis told investors not to hold their breath for another company-transforming acquisition.
While it may make bolt-on acquisitions, Xstrata was focusing on making existing assets perform and developing new ones, he said.
All coal from the first Wandoan mine, which will be one of Australia's biggest, could be exported through Gladstone's planned Wiggins Island terminal.
If Wandoan is expanded, under Xstrata's plan to have four mines each producing 25 million tonnes a year there, coal would probably be shipped through Xstrata's planned Port Alma terminal to the north of Gladstone.
Port Alma is being designed to handle 35 million tonnes a year, but could be expanded.
Xstrata owns 75 per cent of the Wandoan leases, with Itochu and Sumitomo owning 12.5 per cent each.
Xstrata says the area could contain between four and 7.7 billion tonnes of coal. About $3bn will be spent building the first mine at Wandoan, which is currently going through the approvals process, and about the same again for infrastructure. Construction is to start next year, with first coal exports in 2014. The three other mines are expected to cost $2bn-$3bn each, with lower infrastructure costs.
The ETS and any resource rent tax could affect the development, Xstrata said.
What now in Wandoan? After the article from the Australian of 1/2/10 (see scedd's post above) Ray Mortimer is being run off his feet. Investors want anything he has got, both houses and vacant land. Refer back to scedd's post of 17 December, he provides a word picture of Wandoan i.e. there is only limited land in the area due to swampy land on one side, native title on the other and mining leases on the others.
The hotels, motels and caravan parks are charging $130 plus per night for accomodation and these are booked out many months ahead by gas, coal and infrasrtucture companies. I can see rents reaching the dizzy heights of Moranbah and Dysart. $1000 plus a week. Harry Potter in his post above seems to agree with this. And this is only the beginning!!!!
I suggest people to get into the area while you can. Get in touch with Ray Mortimer at Wandoan Realty. But do it quick as he is running out of property. He tells me that people are after any homes as they will knock them down and rebuild!!!!!
Dodger
What now in Wandoan? After the article from the Australian of 1/2/10 (see scedd's post above) Ray Mortimer is being run off his feet. Investors want anything he has got, both houses and vacant land. Refer back to scedd's post of 17 December, he provides a word picture of Wandoan i.e. there is only limited land in the area due to swampy land on one side, native title on the other and mining leases on the others.
The hotels, motels and caravan parks are charging $130 plus per night for accomodation and these are booked out many months ahead by gas, coal and infrasrtucture companies. I can see rents reaching the dizzy heights of Moranbah and Dysart. $1000 plus a week. Harry Potter in his post above seems to agree with this. And this is only the beginning!!!!
I suggest people to get into the area while you can. Get in touch with Ray Mortimer at Wandoan Realty. But do it quick as he is running out of property. He tells me that people are after any homes as they will knock them down and rebuild!!!!!
Dodger
As well as the projects mentions from Chinchilla to Wandoan, much of the viability depends on rail and electricity supply to the region. I have been informed that the rail corrider will be officially resumed in March 2010, and during 2010, higher voltage electricity lines will go from a Chinchilla to sw of Wandoan, making the operations of the CSG and coal companies a reality, including QGC, Origin and Xstrata. I notice much focus has been set on residential property, and rural property has been overlooked. There are smaller ( 500 acre to 1500 acre) lifestyle grazing blocks located near QGC/ Origin/Linc/ Xstrata…that not only provide passive income and tax benifits through grazing cattle or cropping ( or adjisting the land), but the demand will increase for rural lifestyle blocks, in a 20 klm vicinity to these opertations. As operations expand, the resource companies will aslo increase demand for these properties, and they prices!!
BananA
has a 24 hour Truck Stop Service Station, Post Office, Great School, if the kids are in high school they catch a bus to Moura 10 minutes away, Hotel with rooms Drive though, Caravan Park, there is lots of cheap land. I have sold 4 so far in 4 months. 45 mins to Baralaba, 40 mins to Biloela, 10 mins to Moura/Dawson Mines. 1 1/2 hours to Rockhampton and Gladstone.If you want the big block and get in before the boooooom now is the time. CALL ME
email mea new taskforce is been set up in qld to help fast track mining projects. I believe these towns should benefit from this in the coming months
Well, looking at the median house prices in moura…. In a matter of a month, house prices doubled!
Median house prices in may were at 215'000… and in july, the median price was 400'000!
So, what makes you guys think this is going to boom… it looks like it already has, and since then, prices have fallen back to the 250 mark.
Looks like a pretty volatile investment to me. What makes you think it's ready for another boom?
Heard that Wandoan has gone crazy. Since the announcement last week about the BG's $60 billion gas development, investors have desceended on Wandoan and bought most of the existing houses that are for sale and any spare land for future building. 4 bedroom houses are being rented for $600 plus a week. This is only the beginning. Xstrata are believed to be making an announcement soon, and the there are also the final approvals for the railway and the gas pipelines.
Ray Mortimer of Wandoan Reality is doing a very brisk business.
Dodger
Aquila/Vales massive project, Belvedere near Moura has passed pre feasibility the other day so thats moving forward in leaps and bounds. Keep an eye on Shift Miner mag, http://shiftminer.com/news.php?g_Year=2010&g_Page=2 which gives constant updates on projects in the mining industry. All good news for the industry and for investors!
Benjamin Csikos wrote:Well, looking at the median house prices in moura…. In a matter of a month, house prices doubled!Median house prices in may were at 215'000… and in july, the median price was 400'000!
So, what makes you guys think this is going to boom… it looks like it already has, and since then, prices have fallen back to the 250 mark.
Looks like a pretty volatile investment to me. What makes you think it's ready for another boom?
Ben,
have a deeper look and you will see an anomally in there. A true sale just not a residential house. Dont panis, the boom did not come and go!!!!I note that Belvedere has announced that it is finished its prefeasibility study and is moving forward to the next stage. Over $700million for surface infrastructure works (site buildings, coal loaders, roads etc) so that the mine can commence rapidly thereafter. That will bring in an influx of workers!! Coal expected to start 2014 with a 20-30 year life span and now talk of a profit driven (rather than capital cost driven) coal gas enterprise on the side.
All our rentals are now tenanted and we have approvals for building units. Early discussions with corporates look good for these to be taken before they are built, as the big homes arent suitable for the workers, more mine boss style. May have to see if other projects allow the financing of this one otherwise……to market to market it will go. I think I would prefer to avoid the local REAs there at this stage, any suggestions on where I could list the DA approved project? I prefer my rentals so even if finance works this one may go.
Mick
newbi2
check pm, thanks
has a 24 hour Truck Stop Service Station, Post Office, Great School, if the kids are in high school they catch a bus to Moura 10 minutes away, Hotel with rooms Drive though, Caravan Park, there is lots of cheap land. I have sold 4 so far in 4 months. 45 mins to Baralaba, 40 mins to Biloela, 10 mins to Moura/Dawson Mines. 1 1/2 hours to Rockhampton and Gladstone.
email me
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