Forum Replies Created
look at http://www.trustdeed.com.au for heaps of info and some strategies.
Terryw | Structuring Lawyers Pty Ltd / Loan Structuring Pty Ltd
http://www.Structuring.com.au
Email MeLawyer, Mortgage Broker and Tax Advisor (Sydney based but advising Aust wide) http://www.Structuring.com.au
A trust needs a trustee. This can be one person, two or more people OR a company or 2 or more companies OR 1 company and one person etc etc.
Having a company as trustee is safer as it distances yourself from the trust assets. The company will only act as the owner of the property on behalf of the trust. So all the rent will go to the trust. The trust can then distribute any profit (if any) to the beneficiaries – who are not necessarily the shareholders of the company.
Keep in mind that, if there is a loss then this loss cannot be distributed. ie you cannot use the loss to reduce personal tax.
If you wish to transfer your property to the trust, then you must 'sell' it. Which means stamp duty will be payable on the purchase by the trust. New loan will be needed too – and probably exit fees as well as legals on the transfer.
Terryw | Structuring Lawyers Pty Ltd / Loan Structuring Pty Ltd
http://www.Structuring.com.au
Email MeLawyer, Mortgage Broker and Tax Advisor (Sydney based but advising Aust wide) http://www.Structuring.com.au
Watch out for damage in common areas – they will all blame each other.
The people that i know doing it are Thai and they rent out to other Thai students. pile them in. It was going so well in the place they lived at they rented another one up the road. But they can go there and check things out when they pick up the rent etc. I als knew one Japanese student who was living in a 2 bedroom unit with 9 people!
Terryw | Structuring Lawyers Pty Ltd / Loan Structuring Pty Ltd
http://www.Structuring.com.au
Email MeLawyer, Mortgage Broker and Tax Advisor (Sydney based but advising Aust wide) http://www.Structuring.com.au
big risk. if they damage the property you will be responsible. If you understand this, then good idea.
I know of people doing it in the inner city and making $200 approx per week per unit.Terryw | Structuring Lawyers Pty Ltd / Loan Structuring Pty Ltd
http://www.Structuring.com.au
Email MeLawyer, Mortgage Broker and Tax Advisor (Sydney based but advising Aust wide) http://www.Structuring.com.au
Qlds007 wrote:ObieSorry but that is one of the issues of X collateralising loans you just cant do it
If my IP lender does not want to remove the second mortgage on my PPOR I will just refinance them out of the equation.Assume that the Investment property has increased in value but your PPOR has fallen in value or has remained stagnant.
Sure you maybe able to refinance the IP loan but your existing lender may also ask you to pay down some of the debt on your PPOR mortgage.The whole concept of refinancing is usually to raise funds for further deposits but it is not that easy.
I have had 101 clients approach me over the years asking us to unravel the mess they have got into with X collateralising securities and you are at the prayer and whim of the existing lender.
This recently happened to one of my friends. cross collateralised 2 properties. He had a heart attack and got behind etc then tried to sell one, but couldn't as the bank wouldn't release the mortgage without a $40,000 repayment on the remaining loan. values had dropped and he was tied in. he is going under now.
Terryw | Structuring Lawyers Pty Ltd / Loan Structuring Pty Ltd
http://www.Structuring.com.au
Email MeLawyer, Mortgage Broker and Tax Advisor (Sydney based but advising Aust wide) http://www.Structuring.com.au
It is possible for claim the interest on that 10% withdrawn from the main loan. But it is very messy and not the ideal way to do so. It will create future problems trying to work out the claimable portion because it is one big loan.
The ATO considers each subsequent repayment into that loan as coming off the main loan and IP loan in proportions to the original amount. confusing?
eg. $100,000 loan, balance is $90,000 and you take out $10,000 for an IP. 90% of the interest on this loan is non-deductible and 10% is deductible.
If you were to deposit $1000 in the future 90% of this would come off the main part and 10% off the IP part. if you were to make another deposit, then the same.
After 10 deposits it can get very messy.
Ideally you want the IP portion to stay at interest only and all the repayments to go to the main PPOR portion to repay non-deductible debt faster.
Therefore a separate split is much better.
Terryw | Structuring Lawyers Pty Ltd / Loan Structuring Pty Ltd
http://www.Structuring.com.au
Email MeLawyer, Mortgage Broker and Tax Advisor (Sydney based but advising Aust wide) http://www.Structuring.com.au
One potential problem is that the 3 properties will be cross collateralised. Better to have 1 LOC on each – but this may not be practical if you have a little bit of equity in each.
Terryw | Structuring Lawyers Pty Ltd / Loan Structuring Pty Ltd
http://www.Structuring.com.au
Email MeLawyer, Mortgage Broker and Tax Advisor (Sydney based but advising Aust wide) http://www.Structuring.com.au
Hi Don
I agree with Richard. These days the lenders will not like this sort of deal.
What you are doing is essentially borrowing the $125,000 from the vendor. So I would suggest you need a separate contract for this and leave the contract of sale for the property as is.
Maybe a verbal offer with an explanation is better than a written one. And you should be using a solicitor to do it in case your offer is accepted.
Terryw | Structuring Lawyers Pty Ltd / Loan Structuring Pty Ltd
http://www.Structuring.com.au
Email MeLawyer, Mortgage Broker and Tax Advisor (Sydney based but advising Aust wide) http://www.Structuring.com.au
Why sell your existing property? You will only have to pay stamp duty, legals, loan fees (and exit fees?) again, and your equity will probably decrease.
Firstly you should consider that most of these partnerships fail. You will need to discuss what will you do if he wants out or you want out?
I think using a discretionary trust with a corporate trustee may be helpful in this case. If he wants out you can just sell the shares in the company without having to change the ownership. It can be good for decreasing tax too, but the trustee has discretion on the distribution, so this needs to be considered. You can both be directors and shareholders of the trustee and therefore control this.
You will need some advice too, about setup, lending money to the trust for the deposit, loan agreements for this etc.
Terryw | Structuring Lawyers Pty Ltd / Loan Structuring Pty Ltd
http://www.Structuring.com.au
Email MeLawyer, Mortgage Broker and Tax Advisor (Sydney based but advising Aust wide) http://www.Structuring.com.au
If the woman paid you directly, then i believe she has a strong case for having a beneficial interest in the property – as these funds were directly used to purchase the property.
And Pully makes a good point about the mental illness and capacity.
Very messy, sorry to say I don't think it looks good for Websa. Please seek legal advice asap.
Terryw | Structuring Lawyers Pty Ltd / Loan Structuring Pty Ltd
http://www.Structuring.com.au
Email MeLawyer, Mortgage Broker and Tax Advisor (Sydney based but advising Aust wide) http://www.Structuring.com.au
depends on your situation and the state you are in. In NSW you may be exempt up to around $550,000 i think. But in VIC you are only exempt if you are married with children and the cut off is much lower.
Terryw | Structuring Lawyers Pty Ltd / Loan Structuring Pty Ltd
http://www.Structuring.com.au
Email MeLawyer, Mortgage Broker and Tax Advisor (Sydney based but advising Aust wide) http://www.Structuring.com.au
Hi Angela.
Yes, units are consider property of the owner. so not asset protection. An interest in a discretionary trust is not property until a declaration of distribution is made. There have been some exceptions in a recent case (Richstar), but there were cases after this that did not follow that decision. Anyway a DT is the safes way to go, but lack of negative gearing can be a problem. A way around this is to try to divert some other income into the trust to offset the loss.
Terryw | Structuring Lawyers Pty Ltd / Loan Structuring Pty Ltd
http://www.Structuring.com.au
Email MeLawyer, Mortgage Broker and Tax Advisor (Sydney based but advising Aust wide) http://www.Structuring.com.au
I am already getting emails (on my fake account which I gave that company) for new business opportunities. There was one about forex trading and others too.
Terryw | Structuring Lawyers Pty Ltd / Loan Structuring Pty Ltd
http://www.Structuring.com.au
Email MeLawyer, Mortgage Broker and Tax Advisor (Sydney based but advising Aust wide) http://www.Structuring.com.au
Yes, i agree. You could set up a trust. Discretionary or bare trust, depending on what you want to do in the future – but the trustee would be on the loan and to take the risk. You can change trustees later on with only nominal stamp duty -when you reach 18 and qualify for a loan.
Terryw | Structuring Lawyers Pty Ltd / Loan Structuring Pty Ltd
http://www.Structuring.com.au
Email MeLawyer, Mortgage Broker and Tax Advisor (Sydney based but advising Aust wide) http://www.Structuring.com.au
Good points Linar.
Websa, now you know why those 2 had bad credit in the first place!
Sorry, i don't know anything about SA.
good luck and keep us informed.
Terryw | Structuring Lawyers Pty Ltd / Loan Structuring Pty Ltd
http://www.Structuring.com.au
Email MeLawyer, Mortgage Broker and Tax Advisor (Sydney based but advising Aust wide) http://www.Structuring.com.au
Yes, in NSW you will be charged stamp duty on the value. OSR may even require you to get a valuation to back it up. One of my clients did this recently.
There may also be implications if the gifter goes into bankruptcy. If they go bankrupt creditors will look to see what assets were disposed of and then look into those transactions. If they are not done at market rates they may try to reverse those transactions on the basis of them being done to defeat creditors.
If the person gifting is going to apply for the pension, then the social security office may penalise them for up to 2 years.
Terryw | Structuring Lawyers Pty Ltd / Loan Structuring Pty Ltd
http://www.Structuring.com.au
Email MeLawyer, Mortgage Broker and Tax Advisor (Sydney based but advising Aust wide) http://www.Structuring.com.au
Hi IT
Yes, bank woud want security – more than neccessary usually.
Firstly they would want the trustee to guarantee the loan, then they would want all the unit holders to guarantee the loan. If the unit holders are companies, all the directors, if the unit holders are trusts, then all the trustees.
So it can get messy and it can be difficult to find a lender for unit trusts too.
What is good from a tax or asset point of view is not always good from a lending point of view.
Terryw | Structuring Lawyers Pty Ltd / Loan Structuring Pty Ltd
http://www.Structuring.com.au
Email MeLawyer, Mortgage Broker and Tax Advisor (Sydney based but advising Aust wide) http://www.Structuring.com.au
If you pay off the property and then want to move and buy a new place to live in you could end up with no deductions on the old one and so pay more tax and, since you have no cash left will have to borrow to pay for the new one and the interest won't be deductible.
Terryw | Structuring Lawyers Pty Ltd / Loan Structuring Pty Ltd
http://www.Structuring.com.au
Email MeLawyer, Mortgage Broker and Tax Advisor (Sydney based but advising Aust wide) http://www.Structuring.com.au
hi it
You would each have your own units, like shares in a company. eg 100 units with 5 people = 20 units each. You could each hold these units in your own names, or jointly with a spouse, or, preferably via a discretionary trust. What the others do with theirs is up to them, but it would be preferrable if each had their own DT incase of bankruptcy. You wouldn't want 3 of them to go bankrupt (eg they do another JV project between them) and their creditors get their units and control of the trust.
Anyway, if you do it like this and there is a profit of, say $100,000. each partner would get $20,000 profit and this profit, if in a DT could then be distributed to the lowest income earners of your family. I think each kids is allowed $2666 each year before paying tax. A non working spouse can earn about $11,000 pa with no tax etc. This can save you a bit.
Terryw | Structuring Lawyers Pty Ltd / Loan Structuring Pty Ltd
http://www.Structuring.com.au
Email MeLawyer, Mortgage Broker and Tax Advisor (Sydney based but advising Aust wide) http://www.Structuring.com.au
What state are you in?
Sounds like that woman has an equitable interest in the property as she contributed to the purchase price. Since this means she has a caveatable interest it may be hard to remove the caveat by going legal on her, and could be very costly in the supreme court. You may need to negotiate with her, or her parents – maybe they may be more reasonable.
Get some old law textbooks – you can get them very cheap from the uni second hand bookshops and learn as much as you can about caveats and equitable interests. At the same time seek the advice of a solicitor.
Terryw | Structuring Lawyers Pty Ltd / Loan Structuring Pty Ltd
http://www.Structuring.com.au
Email MeLawyer, Mortgage Broker and Tax Advisor (Sydney based but advising Aust wide) http://www.Structuring.com.au



